As per other posts I have discovered that my HQ stub axle/HX caliper combo fouls on the upper control arm, leading to surprise episodes of no pedal while parking.
Looking through my pile of H series calipers it seems unlikely any of the others offer any better clearance.
Considering my options of cutting a relieving "eyebrow" for clearance, refitting the originals or using an aftermarket option I chose to explore the latter.
Hoppers were sort of helpful over the phone. Couldn't tell me which wheels would clear their kit. Sent me a template via email and left me to work out myself whether they would clear. They wanted $1495 plus delivery for their kit.
UPC were happy to say the 287 kit would clear nearly any 15 inch wheel I was likely to use bar the good Ol dodgy Simmons. They list their kit on eBay at two prices, $895 and $995. They ask do a weekly $1 start auction and watching these for a while I saw them go as cheap as $612. After a few weeks of patience I got mine for $700. Picked it up from their factory which I travel near most weeks.
Opening it up the hubs and adaptor dogbones look well made.
Got it fitted up without any drama of significance. Had to minor clearance one end of the stub/dogbone on one side. Looking at the stubs there was a bit of variance in the thickness in this location. I can't read the cast numbers as they are too faint so not sure wether it's an original stub or not. Took 10 min of file work.
Took it for a drive and all works fine. Tried the usual parking manoeuvres etc and all seems to clear fine.
So no problems here.
I have taken a step by step set of pics if anyone is interested.
Fitting UPC 287mm Torana stub kit to LX hatch
Started by
rexy
, Oct 04 2014 09:49 PM
60 replies to this topic
#1
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Posted 04 October 2014 - 09:49 PM
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 03:45 AM
Hey Rexy
When you say you was running HQ style brakes and stubs what side of the stub did you have the calipers front or rear of stub ???
I found in the past that Hoppers said there smaller kit 287mm would fit the Simmons wheels
and as for UPC for get it .....the guy wouldn't even return my calls and I rang 3 times over a week and the lady said she would get him to return my call as he was busy ....mmm must be still busy
and yes we are all interested .....( pics )....in how it fits and works
Thanks Kevin
When you say you was running HQ style brakes and stubs what side of the stub did you have the calipers front or rear of stub ???
I found in the past that Hoppers said there smaller kit 287mm would fit the Simmons wheels
and as for UPC for get it .....the guy wouldn't even return my calls and I rang 3 times over a week and the lady said she would get him to return my call as he was busy ....mmm must be still busy
and yes we are all interested .....( pics )....in how it fits and works
Thanks Kevin
#3
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 07:57 AM
I bought a kit off them pretty cheap as well, I seen them selling on eBay and I just rang them and they done it for the same price, I am yet to properly fit mine but i did dummy 1 side to check clearance and it seemed good.
I will be fitting them in the next few weeks and I'll be adding some pics here to.
I am sure a few people will like to see step by step pics
I will be fitting them in the next few weeks and I'll be adding some pics here to.
I am sure a few people will like to see step by step pics
#4
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 10:08 AM
I've had mine sitting in on the bench still in their boxes for over 3yrs but just haven't tried fitting them yet. Pics would be great guys.
Cheers, Nig.
Cheers, Nig.
#5
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 10:18 AM
I have said many times here that I have bought them and fitted them to one of my torana's. They are defintely good bang for buck. I now have Hoppers on my new car and I honestly can't pick the difference in perfomance between the two brands. With a little filing and mechanical experience they are easy to fit up. I would certainly buy them again.
#6
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 04:51 PM
Okay, this may take a few posts to get all the pictures up so bear with me.
The current set up was HX tonner stubs with the original Torana LX caliper bodies with the longer HX slides. As above it touched on extremes of lock. Not a disaster and potentially fixed for nothing with a stop or relief notching but I viewed it as an opportunity to do this.
You will need:
A basic socket set.
Some larger spanners won't hurt.
A flat blade screwdriver.
Pliers.
New split pins.
High temp bearing grease.
Two jacks.
Two hammers or similar.
Gloves and rags.
File.
A modicum of patience.
My fitment is a little longer than if you have standard brakes as I had to change back to Torana stubs.
The first thing I did was dummy assemble one side onto the Torana stub to see if it would clear the wheels.
This is what the inside of an original 15X7 Hotwire looks like. Assembly seems to clear fine.
The current set up was HX tonner stubs with the original Torana LX caliper bodies with the longer HX slides. As above it touched on extremes of lock. Not a disaster and potentially fixed for nothing with a stop or relief notching but I viewed it as an opportunity to do this.
You will need:
A basic socket set.
Some larger spanners won't hurt.
A flat blade screwdriver.
Pliers.
New split pins.
High temp bearing grease.
Two jacks.
Two hammers or similar.
Gloves and rags.
File.
A modicum of patience.
My fitment is a little longer than if you have standard brakes as I had to change back to Torana stubs.
The first thing I did was dummy assemble one side onto the Torana stub to see if it would clear the wheels.
This is what the inside of an original 15X7 Hotwire looks like. Assembly seems to clear fine.
Edited by rexy, 05 October 2014 - 04:52 PM.
#7
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 05:08 PM
Of course the car is by now jacked up under the gearbox crossmember mount where it bolts to the chassis.
With the wheel off its time to put the second Jack under the lower control arm at the shock mount.
Unbolt the caliper and hang it up out of the way. (Spanner and hex key required for the alloy LX caliper)
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Remove dust cap from rotor (flat blade screwdriver)
Undo split pin and remove castellated nut.
Remove disc. Don't lose the dust cap , castellated nut and bearing retaining washer, you will need them for reinstall.
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Things should now look like this.
Do not undo the brake lines yet. You will make a big mess of brake fluid as the system drains itself. More on that later.
With the wheel off its time to put the second Jack under the lower control arm at the shock mount.
Unbolt the caliper and hang it up out of the way. (Spanner and hex key required for the alloy LX caliper)
image.jpg 204.27K
26 downloadsRemove dust cap from rotor (flat blade screwdriver)
Undo split pin and remove castellated nut.
Remove disc. Don't lose the dust cap , castellated nut and bearing retaining washer, you will need them for reinstall.
image.jpg 188.13K
30 downloadsThings should now look like this.
Do not undo the brake lines yet. You will make a big mess of brake fluid as the system drains itself. More on that later.
Edited by rexy, 05 October 2014 - 05:11 PM.
#8
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 05:23 PM
The next few steps are only needed if you are changing or swapping around stub axles.
Undo the two bolts holding the steering arm on. Move it gently to safety.
image.jpg 179.09K
24 downloads
Remove the split pins from the castellated nuts on the upper and lower ball joints. You may have nyloc nuts in which case you may like to source new ones for reassembly.
Unwind the nuts a few turns. Not too far though.
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Should look like this now.
There a quite a few theories on how to separate ball joints. I am a fan of tapping both sides of the stub adjacent to the ball joint insertion. This leaves the ball joint intact for re-use. Patience grasshopper.
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Like this but with a hammer in each hand obviously.
Keep a close eye on the castellated nuts as they will spin while you are tapping and you don't want one to come off. You can reinstall a split pin for safety while you do this if you like. The Jack under the lower control arm should be let down so it is no longer supporting it. Leave it about a cm below.
Undo the two bolts holding the steering arm on. Move it gently to safety.
image.jpg 179.09K
24 downloadsRemove the split pins from the castellated nuts on the upper and lower ball joints. You may have nyloc nuts in which case you may like to source new ones for reassembly.
Unwind the nuts a few turns. Not too far though.
image.jpg 138.09K
25 downloadsShould look like this now.
There a quite a few theories on how to separate ball joints. I am a fan of tapping both sides of the stub adjacent to the ball joint insertion. This leaves the ball joint intact for re-use. Patience grasshopper.
image.jpg 181.33K
23 downloadsLike this but with a hammer in each hand obviously.
Keep a close eye on the castellated nuts as they will spin while you are tapping and you don't want one to come off. You can reinstall a split pin for safety while you do this if you like. The Jack under the lower control arm should be let down so it is no longer supporting it. Leave it about a cm below.
Edited by rexy, 05 October 2014 - 05:28 PM.
#10
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 05:54 PM
Re Jack the lower control arm to compress and hold the spring.
Remove the castellated nuts. Obviously keep them for reinstall.
You can now lift the upper control arm off the stub axle like this.
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Now lift the stub off the lower ball joint.
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As you can see the lower ball joint rubber is perished. Pair of replacement rubbers was $7 from repco.
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Remove the castellated nuts. Obviously keep them for reinstall.
You can now lift the upper control arm off the stub axle like this.
image.jpg 140.29K
23 downloadsNow lift the stub off the lower ball joint.
image.jpg 151.02K
21 downloadsAs you can see the lower ball joint rubber is perished. Pair of replacement rubbers was $7 from repco.
image.jpg 371.47K
16 downloads
image.jpg 265.46K
19 downloads
#11
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 06:15 PM
Now things head forward!
Re grease ball joints.
Install new ball joint rubber.
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From your brake kit install the new inner dust seal onto the stub. Use grease sparingingly to fit.
Install inner bearing, it's the larger of the two. Inner and outer bearings appear to be standard holden sizes.
Grease liberally and work the grease into the bearing by finger.
Fit stub by placing on lower ball joint then lowering upper arm to install upper balljoint.
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Install castellated nuts, torque to spec and install new split pins.
Reinstall steering arm.
Grease the smaller outer bearing.
Install your new hub. Install the outer bearing.
Add the old retaining washer. You will note it has a locating tab that fits in the slot in the threaded part of the stub.
Reinstall the castellated nut. Tighten slowly and gently with your large adjustable spanner to seat the bearings. Back it off and now tighten with your fingers. Take it back just enough after it seats to get the split pin in the first available hole.
image.jpg 277.75K
26 downloads
Re grease ball joints.
Install new ball joint rubber.
image.jpg 277.45K
22 downloadsFrom your brake kit install the new inner dust seal onto the stub. Use grease sparingingly to fit.
Install inner bearing, it's the larger of the two. Inner and outer bearings appear to be standard holden sizes.
Grease liberally and work the grease into the bearing by finger.
Fit stub by placing on lower ball joint then lowering upper arm to install upper balljoint.
image.jpg 171.01K
30 downloadsInstall castellated nuts, torque to spec and install new split pins.
Reinstall steering arm.
Grease the smaller outer bearing.
Install your new hub. Install the outer bearing.
Add the old retaining washer. You will note it has a locating tab that fits in the slot in the threaded part of the stub.
Reinstall the castellated nut. Tighten slowly and gently with your large adjustable spanner to seat the bearings. Back it off and now tighten with your fingers. Take it back just enough after it seats to get the split pin in the first available hole.
image.jpg 277.75K
26 downloads
Edited by rexy, 05 October 2014 - 06:17 PM.
#12
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 06:27 PM
At this point I mock fitted the adaptor dogbone which mounts the caliper to the stub. Here I found my only curve ball.
I had to take a little material from the stub and also took a little from the dogbone as per the pics. This appears to be due to variation in the stubs. The other side was fine.
It's the area in the pics where the paint is missing.
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Little bit off the dogbone.
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After this I fitted the dogbone and caliper to the stub to check lock to lock clearance.
image.jpg 362.46K
19 downloads
Looks like plenty of space.
I had to take a little material from the stub and also took a little from the dogbone as per the pics. This appears to be due to variation in the stubs. The other side was fine.
It's the area in the pics where the paint is missing.
image.jpg 147.07K
24 downloadsLittle bit off the dogbone.
image.jpg 282.12K
24 downloadsAfter this I fitted the dogbone and caliper to the stub to check lock to lock clearance.
image.jpg 362.46K
19 downloadsLooks like plenty of space.
Edited by rexy, 05 October 2014 - 06:28 PM.
#13
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#14
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 07:10 PM
Looks like they fit like a glove. I trial fitted mine and went together no problem as well. Did you swap stubs left to right?
#15
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 07:11 PM
Now it's time to install the new provided brake line. Make sure you use the provided copper washers. One goes between the head of the bolt and the line, The other between the line and the caliper body.
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Undo the line from the old caliper where it joins the hard line in the upper inner wheel arch.
Very quickly attach the new line as the brake fluid attempts to escape.
I found the system gravity bled itself quite nicely.
Top up brake fluid.
Reinstall wheel. You will need new wheel nuts unless your old setup had half inch studs (std holden is 7/16). These cost me $20.
Check you have a brake pedal.
Trundle around the block to test.
Recheck on return for brake fluid level, leaks and check bolt tightness.
image.jpg 151.84K
29 downloadsUndo the line from the old caliper where it joins the hard line in the upper inner wheel arch.
Very quickly attach the new line as the brake fluid attempts to escape.
I found the system gravity bled itself quite nicely.
Top up brake fluid.
Reinstall wheel. You will need new wheel nuts unless your old setup had half inch studs (std holden is 7/16). These cost me $20.
Check you have a brake pedal.
Trundle around the block to test.
Recheck on return for brake fluid level, leaks and check bolt tightness.
#16
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 07:23 PM
I will add that the handling seems a bit nicer than it was with the HQ setup.
The front end height had increased as per the before and after pics. It settled about a cm from the after pic with a drive around the block.
Before
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After
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It's hard to believe there is $800 worth of extra value in the Hoppers kit.
The front end height had increased as per the before and after pics. It settled about a cm from the after pic with a drive around the block.
Before
image.jpg 240.21K
20 downloadsAfter
image.jpg 222.31K
24 downloadsIt's hard to believe there is $800 worth of extra value in the Hoppers kit.
Edited by rexy, 05 October 2014 - 07:25 PM.
#17
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 08:46 PM
Looks like they fit like a glove. I trial fitted mine and went together no problem as well. Did you swap stubs left to right?
Stubs are as per factory fitment. No side to side swap.
#18
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Posted 05 October 2014 - 09:00 PM
Hey RexyWhen you say you was running HQ style brakes and stubs what side of the stub did you have the calipers front or rear of stub ???I found in the past that Hoppers said there smaller kit 287mm would fit the Simmons wheelsand as for UPC for get it .....the guy wouldn't even return my calls and I rang 3 times over a week and the lady said she would get him to return my call as he was busy ....mmm must be still busyand yes we are all interested .....( pics )....in how it fits and worksThanks Kevin
The HQ setup was calipers on the front.
UPC were off eBay for a littl while. Perhaps there is a simple explanation?
#19
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Posted 06 October 2014 - 04:42 AM
Its Funny how your UPC set up works fine and your happy with it all......awhile ago every one was warning one another to stay well clear of them .....
what are we missing ???
what are we missing ???
#20
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Posted 06 October 2014 - 06:45 AM
I think most of the issues have been with their larger 330 mm set up?
#21
_LS2 Hatch_
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Posted 06 October 2014 - 06:52 AM
I have the big brake set up on my hatch too. Only difference is I went for commodore stud pattern. They fit straight up with very little to no filling needed.
The guy from Hoppers had a look at my car and thought that it was his set up. When I said it was UPC, he told he knew thy would work fine as they were a direct copy of his.
It's the larger 330mm set up that everyone complains about.
The guy from Hoppers had a look at my car and thought that it was his set up. When I said it was UPC, he told he knew thy would work fine as they were a direct copy of his.
It's the larger 330mm set up that everyone complains about.
#22
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Posted 06 October 2014 - 01:01 PM
Good tutorial there Rexy well done. Maybe this could be put up as a sticky.
How much better do you find this brake kit over your old HX calipers? As you know I bought my HX calipers off you and fitted them about 12 months ago, they seem to be a little better than the old standard calipers I had.
As you have HQ stubs I wonder if having the original Torana stubs would make any difference to the fitment?
#23
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Posted 06 October 2014 - 03:44 PM
Going from the original solid discs to the milled down HQ disc with the long HX slides on the LX calipers was a big improvement, particularly in fade resistance. Pad choice made a big difference too.
The HX tonner stubs with the same caliper were slightly better again presumably due to leverage effect with the larger diameter disc.
This UPC setup seems at least as good and likely better. It's early days and I am still letting the pads bed in until I give it a good workout.
If I still had the original LX stubs fitted I could have left out the middle bit of the changeover where I swapped the HX stubs out and put the original LX ones back in. Makes it a much shorter job. At least it gave me a chance to replace the perished ball joint rubbers.
The HX tonner stubs with the same caliper were slightly better again presumably due to leverage effect with the larger diameter disc.
This UPC setup seems at least as good and likely better. It's early days and I am still letting the pads bed in until I give it a good workout.
If I still had the original LX stubs fitted I could have left out the middle bit of the changeover where I swapped the HX stubs out and put the original LX ones back in. Makes it a much shorter job. At least it gave me a chance to replace the perished ball joint rubbers.
#24
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Posted 06 October 2014 - 05:30 PM
I am very interested to know ....what is the exact problem with the 330mm kits and I seen on E-bay UPC also have a bigger 383mm I think .....has anyone used these ????I have the big brake set up on my hatch too. Only difference is I went for commodore stud pattern. They fit straight up with very little to no filling needed.
The guy from Hoppers had a look at my car and thought that it was his set up. When I said it was UPC, he told he knew thy would work fine as they were a direct copy of his.
It's the larger 330mm set up that everyone complains about.
#25
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Posted 06 October 2014 - 05:36 PM
Sorry I could be wrong about the 383mm.....getting old
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