i have been offered a crossflow duggan head for a 202...cast...firstly i thought they were all alloy....secondly crossflow??.....i thought they were angle port heads...if such an animal exists please let me know cos the price is fair but the thing is too far away for me to go chase a yowie??
duggan cylinder head
Started by
_willo_
, Jan 31 2009 07:45 AM
12 replies to this topic
#2
_Drag lc_
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 07:50 AM
Willo,
to my knowelge a jzed head is verry simalar to a duggan yes they were alloy, no i dont beleive they were cross flow, yes only the intake is angled
have you got a pic of the head?
Thanks hayden
to my knowelge a jzed head is verry simalar to a duggan yes they were alloy, no i dont beleive they were cross flow, yes only the intake is angled
have you got a pic of the head?
Thanks hayden
#3
_willo_
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 07:58 AM
no photo....main reason that i'm a bit suspicious......but the thing is...if a crossflow head to suit a 202 exists....and this chap has one......then i f*cking want it!!!
#4
_why-psi_
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 08:03 AM
its not one of those rare as rocking horse s**t twincam heads is it? being crossflow..
#5
_willo_
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 08:11 AM
well...that's one claim that he hasn't made about it.....all i wanna know is was there a crossflow duggan head or not?...because if there was i believe he has one...but if not i'm not driving that far for an angle port head when i already have one...
#6
GML-31
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 08:43 AM
from Dr Terry on Fastlane forums...
Hi Guys.
This question of cross-flow & twin-cam heads for Holden 6-cyl motors pops up regularly & some of it is urban myth, so I thought that I would tell you what I know to be fact.
The Repco ‘Hi-Power’ cross-flow head was designed by Phil Irving (of Vincent motor cycle & Repco Brabham F1 fame) & was only made to suit the Grey motor. Opinions vary, but it appears that between 100 to 150 of these were made.
The ‘Waggot’ twin-cam head was also only made to suit the Grey. It was designed & made by Merv Waggot of Waggot Engineering at Greenacre in Sydney. Only about 6 or 8 of these were ever made, making then rarer than rocking horse poop.
To my knowledge, there were 2 other heads made for the Grey motor, but again these are very rare. There was another twin-cam head made by Fred Foster (2 or 3 made) & there was also the Dunstall ‘Rotary Valve’ head (6 or 8 made).
Phil Irving also made (this time separate from Repco) a hi-flow head for the Red motor, but only 2 or 3 were ever made. These were not a cross-flow design, but had a high intake port, angled at 45 degrees.
Frank Duggan also designed a similar head to the high-port Irving head for the Red motor. Many of these were made. Duggan's head design was also used in American speedway Chevy 6 & Chevy II (4-cyl) engined cars. AFAIK the Duggan Holden head design (& the dies?) was sold to another guy, who now calls them j.ZED. These are still available today.
I’m sure that there are other one-off Holden heads out there, that we’ve never seen, but other guys have thought more laterally & used heads of other motors to improve the performance of the Red motor. I’ve seen the Falcon alloy cross-flow head fitted to a Holden 202, which, as BrianH has said is far from a bolt-on fit. Believe it or not the bore-centre to bore-centre dimension of the Falcon 6 is the same as a Holden 6, making it at least ‘do-able’. They weld up the hole where the thermostat fits & reverse the head so that the rockers line up on the same side of the motor as the cam. A lot of welding & machining is involved because the head bolt-holes don’t line up, but I know of at least one of these conversions that is complete & working. This would be even more difficult with the Ford 6 DOHC head.
Most of this is, of course beyond the average DIY home mechanic.
Does anybody out there know of any other ‘special’ Holden heads that exist?
Dr Terry.
jzed site
Hi Guys.
This question of cross-flow & twin-cam heads for Holden 6-cyl motors pops up regularly & some of it is urban myth, so I thought that I would tell you what I know to be fact.
The Repco ‘Hi-Power’ cross-flow head was designed by Phil Irving (of Vincent motor cycle & Repco Brabham F1 fame) & was only made to suit the Grey motor. Opinions vary, but it appears that between 100 to 150 of these were made.
The ‘Waggot’ twin-cam head was also only made to suit the Grey. It was designed & made by Merv Waggot of Waggot Engineering at Greenacre in Sydney. Only about 6 or 8 of these were ever made, making then rarer than rocking horse poop.
To my knowledge, there were 2 other heads made for the Grey motor, but again these are very rare. There was another twin-cam head made by Fred Foster (2 or 3 made) & there was also the Dunstall ‘Rotary Valve’ head (6 or 8 made).
Phil Irving also made (this time separate from Repco) a hi-flow head for the Red motor, but only 2 or 3 were ever made. These were not a cross-flow design, but had a high intake port, angled at 45 degrees.
Frank Duggan also designed a similar head to the high-port Irving head for the Red motor. Many of these were made. Duggan's head design was also used in American speedway Chevy 6 & Chevy II (4-cyl) engined cars. AFAIK the Duggan Holden head design (& the dies?) was sold to another guy, who now calls them j.ZED. These are still available today.
I’m sure that there are other one-off Holden heads out there, that we’ve never seen, but other guys have thought more laterally & used heads of other motors to improve the performance of the Red motor. I’ve seen the Falcon alloy cross-flow head fitted to a Holden 202, which, as BrianH has said is far from a bolt-on fit. Believe it or not the bore-centre to bore-centre dimension of the Falcon 6 is the same as a Holden 6, making it at least ‘do-able’. They weld up the hole where the thermostat fits & reverse the head so that the rockers line up on the same side of the motor as the cam. A lot of welding & machining is involved because the head bolt-holes don’t line up, but I know of at least one of these conversions that is complete & working. This would be even more difficult with the Ford 6 DOHC head.
Most of this is, of course beyond the average DIY home mechanic.
Does anybody out there know of any other ‘special’ Holden heads that exist?
Dr Terry.
jzed site
Edited by GML-31, 31 January 2009 - 08:47 AM.
#7
_CraigA_
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 10:04 AM
^^ Gotta love Dr Terry's knowledge.
I went to a Holden trivia night in Canberra a few years back and Terry was there. And who do you think the winner was?????
Some more stuff about crossflow 6 heads buried in here
Crossflow would be rocking horse poo rare but even an original Duggan head would be a worthwhile purchase.
I went to a Holden trivia night in Canberra a few years back and Terry was there. And who do you think the winner was?????
Some more stuff about crossflow 6 heads buried in here
Crossflow would be rocking horse poo rare but even an original Duggan head would be a worthwhile purchase.
#8
_willo_
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 11:41 AM
well....i guess i'm gunna take him at his word and go get it.....at worst it is just an angle port head and i'll double my money on the f*cking thing anyway
#9
_gtr-xu1_
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 01:02 PM
yeah i was gunna say if its a cross flow then its the irving repco head
#10
enderwigginau
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 08:08 PM
Yep,
even if a grey head, the market for these is massive now with the nostalgia movement in full-swing.
There was a fella my old man knew in Melb when he was young (60's) converting red heads to hemi valve setup
One of those would be awesome to find.
I have a feeling someone made a crossflow red, but it was probably a one off.
Grant..
even if a grey head, the market for these is massive now with the nostalgia movement in full-swing.
There was a fella my old man knew in Melb when he was young (60's) converting red heads to hemi valve setup
One of those would be awesome to find.
I have a feeling someone made a crossflow red, but it was probably a one off.
Grant..
#11
_why-psi_
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Posted 31 January 2009 - 08:31 PM
can always make a head out of a pair of V8 heads like these guys did
heres the link for the whole car and engine. can get some good ideas from this
292 Chev inline 6 Studebaker
heres the link for the whole car and engine. can get some good ideas from this
292 Chev inline 6 Studebaker
Edited by why-psi, 31 January 2009 - 08:32 PM.
#13
_Allports_
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Posted 14 April 2009 - 12:28 AM
Thats old hat Boz. Fraud guys used to do that in the states with a clevo head on the 300 six.i love that chev head idea
The Irving head is definately not a cross flow as was in the Grey motor, I ran 1 for a time on my rail (owned by Mr Zullo who still has it) The best that ran was 9.37 @ 143mph. I want to get it off him and play with it one of these days.
Edited by Allports, 14 April 2009 - 12:30 AM.
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