59 replies to this topic

[ribz0]

Hi all

Well, after reading lots and talking to heaps of people, I'm totally confused!!! The only way to really find out was to give it a go. So, here I go.

My aim is to fit a set of HQ-Z GTS rims to my LC Torana. I've heard it all from WHY!! you cant do it, your crazy and did I say WHY!! Why you ask? Well I want to and I like GTS rims. Brake upgrade wont be a bad thing either. Didn't think it was that hard to understand.Lol....

It's a long story but lots of years ago, I bought a LJ torana to do a front disc brake upgrade to my then front drum brake LC. All sweet and all has been great. While starting this conversion, I have found out that I don't have LJ stuff. Maybe someone can help me here. The calipers are on the front, not the rear.

I pulled the stubs off and sat a HJ stub side by side. This is how they look.



I have a RH stub from what I thought was a LJ on the left, and a HJ RH stub on the right. Maybe UC??





The difference I can see is it will be lower, and a more neg camber which I should be able to correct with removing alignment shims. I have used the steering arms that were there, (LJ/UC??) The tie rods fit from the top, not the bottom as were from standard.

Bolted up and it all looks good. Have to work on caliper clearance and the brake lines.



I will keep you posted. I am working on a few things for the rear. Thought about diff conversion but I am going with axle mod with the standard banjo and HJ rear drum brakes.

Comments and advice welcome. Hope the pics work out. First time with the pic thing.

Thanks

Edited by ribz0, 22 April 2010 - 11:17 PM.

[dattoman]

The calipers pictured are HQ-HJ Girlock cast iron
Usually fitted to commercials and 350 powered statemans

[ribz0]

The calipers pictured are HQ-HJ Girlock cast iron
Usually fitted to commercials and 350 powered statemans

Yep, that's right but the stato had a 308 in it. The HJ Statesman was my parts car. Not sure if I should fit 6cyl rear drums or rears of the V8 stato.

[gtrboyy]

I would prefer to use the lc/j stubs,hq calipers,hq discs machined down.
Cousin in law had chev in an lj,did the hq brake conversion & found that the caliper would hit control arm,car handled like crap too.

My lc had hq stubs,330mm brakes.With 18in rims & 1in raised pedders springs it ended up being standard gtr height,had quite a bit of an angle with the steering arms yet handled ok,shimming it for the wheel alignment was a bitch.

Now I'm going back to lc stubs,vk discs machined down to 267mm & hq calipers so I can fit 14in rims.Not sure yet if calipers will hit top control arms.
One day I might put the big brakes back on but it will be with the lc stubs & new caliper brackets.

[ribz0]

I would prefer to use the lc/j stubs,hq calipers,hq discs machined down.

Thanks for that. The prob is that I'm not sure what stubs I have! The fact that the caliper was mounted on the front! Maybe UC?

Would an option be maybe swap what I had from left to right? Also, tie rods fit from top, not from under steering arm. Original LC had caliper at the rear and tie rod fit from under steering arms.

Work in progress!!

Eric

[ribz0]

[quote name='ribz0' date='23 April 2010 - 11:06 AM' timestamp='1271981180' post='501326']
[quote name='gtrboyy' date='23 April 2010 - 08:12 AM' timestamp='1271970766' post='501312']
I would prefer to use the lc/j stubs,hq calipers,hq discs machined down.

[/quote]

Forgot to mention that the caliper hits the rear of the thing that covers the spring halfway down. This is the RHS.



Not sure if the LC had these things, the manual does not show them. Was thinking of removing them which will fix the clearance problem. Is there any issues doing this??

[S pack]

[quote name='ribz0' date='23 April 2010 - 10:28 AM' timestamp='1271982530' post='501329']
[quote name='ribz0' date='23 April 2010 - 11:06 AM' timestamp='1271981180' post='501326']
[quote name='gtrboyy' date='23 April 2010 - 08:12 AM' timestamp='1271970766' post='501312']
I would prefer to use the lc/j stubs,hq calipers,hq discs machined down.

[/quote]

Forgot to mention that the caliper hits the rear of the thing that covers the spring halfway down. This is the RHS.



Not sure if the LC had these things, the manual does not show them. Was thinking of removing them which will fix the clearance problem. Is there any issues doing this??
[/quote]

That metal strut or whatever it is really called is the stop that the bumper bolted to the lower control arm contacts when the suspension bottoms out. Early LC's didn't have the bump rubber on the lower control arm, it was a running change during the LC series. I suspect this change was introduced before the introduction of the XU1 in 1970 but I am not sure. The early LC's had a bracket that mounted above the suspension upper control arm and had a bump rubber the same as the one fitted to the underside of the upper arm. Both upper and lower suspension travel limits were controlled at the upper control arm. You cannot really afford to remove that bracket, you may however be able to remove some metal to allow a bit more clearance. All depends on how much is enough.

Cheers
Dave.

[S pack]

Hi all

Well, after reading lots and talking to heaps of people, I'm totally confused!!! The only way to really find out was to give it a go. So, here I go.

My aim is to fit a set of HQ-Z GTS rims to my LC Torana. I've heard it all from WHY!! you cant do it, your crazy and did I say WHY!! Why you ask? Well I want to and I like GTS rims. Brake upgrade wont be a bad thing either. Didn't think it was that hard to understand.Lol....

It's a long story but lots of years ago, I bought a LJ torana to do a front disc brake upgrade to my then front drum brake LC. All sweet and all has been great. While starting this conversion, I have found out that I don't have LJ stuff. Maybe someone can help me here. The calipers are on the front, not the rear.

I pulled the stubs off and sat a HJ stub side by side. This is how they look.



I have a RH stub from what I thought was a LJ on the left, and a HJ RH stub on the right. Maybe UC??
Comments and advice welcome. Hope the pics work out. First time with the pic thing.

Thanks

Hi Ribz0

The steering knuckle on the left looks like an LC/LJ left hand unit not right hand.
Cast onto the curved outer face of the knuckle should be HOLDEN 49811 B for LC/LJ left knuckle and HOLDEN 49812 B for right knuckle.
LC/LJ steering arms have numbers 5053 cast on left hand arm and 5054 on right hand arm.

Note that the LC/LJ steering knuckles carried over to LH Torana but were swapped left side to right side and vise versa.

Hope this info helps
Cheers
Dave.

[ribz0]

The early LC's had a bracket that mounted above the suspension upper control arm and had a bump rubber the same as the one fitted to the underside of the upper arm. Both upper and lower suspension travel limits were controlled at the upper control arm.
Cheers
Dave.
[/quote]

Thanks Dave.

You are right. I looked at the manual and it did not show it there. My LC has the bump stop at the top wishbone and the rubber stop mounted to the body as well. I cant see any point having two stops can you? The second addition must have appeared when I did the front end change all those years ago with a later LJ, or so I thought! I going down the road of looking at taking it off! I will post a pic of the upper stop tomorrow.

[quote name='S pack' date='24 April 2010 - 01:13 AM' timestamp='1272032016' post='501500']
[quote name='ribz0' date='22 April 2010 - 11:09 PM' timestamp='1271941750' post='501286']
Hi all

Well, after reading lots and talking to heaps of people, I'm totally confused!!! The only way to really find out was to give it a go. So, here I go.

My aim is to fit a set of HQ-Z GTS rims to my LC Torana. I've heard it all from WHY!! you cant do it, your crazy and did I say WHY!! Why you ask? Well I want to and I like GTS rims. Brake upgrade wont be a bad thing either. Didn't think it was that hard to understand.Lol....

It's a long story but lots of years ago, I bought a LJ torana to do a front disc brake upgrade to my then front drum brake LC. All sweet and all has been great. While starting this conversion, I have found out that I don't have LJ stuff. Maybe someone can help me here. The calipers are on the front, not the rear.

I pulled the stubs off and sat a HJ stub side by side. This is how they look.



I have a RH stub from what I thought was a LJ on the left, and a HJ RH stub on the right. Maybe UC??
Comments and advice welcome. Hope the pics work out. First time with the pic thing.

Thanks
[/quote]

Hi Ribz0

The steering knuckle on the left looks like an LC/LJ left hand unit not right hand.
Cast onto the curved outer face of the knuckle should be HOLDEN 49811 B for LC/LJ left knuckle and HOLDEN 49812 B for right knuckle.
LC/LJ steering arms have numbers 5053 cast on left hand arm and 5054 on right hand arm.

Note that the LC/LJ steering knuckles carried over to LH Torana but were swapped left side to right side and vise versa.

Hope this info helps
Cheers
Dave.
[/quote]


Thanks again Dave!!

So you think they may be LC/LJ and they have swapped them over?? I will have a look at some of the numbers on the stub tomorrow and let you know.

[ribz0]

Ok, got some numbers Dave...

I have 49812-B which was one of the numbers you had, and I have a GM 42928? So one is a LC/LJ so what is the other one? I have not got to the steering arm numbers yet.

The pic below is the upper bump stop I have. The top wishbone does not have the small platform for it to mate properly but its there. I will try to find them as they seem to be a bolt on item, not sure but there seems to be a mounting hole for them. So I think I will go ahead and remove the other bump stop mounts from the bottom.



The plot thickens!! Learning lots, thanks very much!!!

[ribz0]

These are the stub axles that were on my LC.



They have different numbers as stated above. Looks like they were swapped from left to right as well. The stubs actually look like they are different heights as well!! hmmmm... interesting.

[S pack]

Ok, got some numbers Dave...

I have 49812-B which was one of the numbers you had, and I have a GM 42928? So one is a LC/LJ so what is the other one? I have not got to the steering arm numbers yet.

The pic below is the upper bump stop I have. The top wishbone does not have the small platform for it to mate properly but its there. I will try to find them as they seem to be a bolt on item, not sure but there seems to be a mounting hole for them. So I think I will go ahead and remove the other bump stop mounts from the bottom.



The plot thickens!! Learning lots, thanks very much!!!

G/Day Ribz0
Have a look at your LC workshop manual if you have one.
The bumpstop platform on top of the upper control arm is welded on. You will prob need to make and weld one on or if you still have the original upper control arms use them.
I presume GMH changed the position of the bumpstop because it was more effective mounted to the lower arm.

That steering knuckle #42928 is a bit of a mystery, its similar but definitely slightly different.
I did read somewhere that the LC/LJ disc brake knuckles were a carry over from the HR model, so I thought the part No. might be the same. Best bet would be to try and locate a 49811-B knuckle if you want to retain the Torana knuckles.
By the way what calipers and rotors were fitted to those, HR, LC/LJ or LH/LX?

Cheers
Dave

[ribz0]

Thanks for that Dave!!

Yes, I did see it in the manual and you are right. Yes, I will have to make something and weld it on. No prob.. Unfortunately, I don't have the original front end. Usual thing, if only.....

Another question for you Dave, on the underside of the top wishbone, there is another bumpstop. Is this an LJ addition as well? Should I remove this also? As for getting another stub and now that I know, I will keep an eye out for a torrie or bits. (fat chance of that without paying too much for it!)



As for what rotors and calipers I had, well I don't really know!! Someone once told me LH rotors but not sure.



Back to work tomorrow so won't be able to get back into the shed till later in the week. Thanks for everyone's help / info so far. Chat later and keep it coming!

Thanks

Eric

[dattoman]

Yes they are LH brakes (also used on early LX)

[ribz0]

Yes they are LH brakes (also used on early LX)

Thank you for that..

[S pack]

Thanks for that Dave!!

Yes, I did see it in the manual and you are right. Yes, I will have to make something and weld it on. No prob.. Unfortunately, I don't have the original front end. Usual thing, if only.....

Another question for you Dave, on the underside of the top wishbone, there is another bumpstop. Is this an LJ addition as well? Should I remove this also? As for getting another stub and now that I know, I will keep an eye out for a torrie or bits. (fat chance of that without paying too much for it!)

Hi Eric

Don't permanently remove that bump rubber it is on all LC/LJ. It limits the rebound travel in the suspension, remove it only if you have to when you weld on the platform, excessive heat could damage it. Be careful though as they are buggers to get out (old rubber could tear) and then harder to put back in - use soapy water to lubricate. Loads of fun and lots of very bad words when I replaced mine.

Cheers
Dave.

PS: I suspected maybe LH discs and calipers due to steering knuckles being swapped over.
That unknown knuckle might be from an LH then.

[ribz0]

Thanks for that Dave,

I'll leave it but yes, I was wondering if it would survive the weld job as well. I'll have a closer look when I can, sort out the removal of the lower bump stop and fit the small platform for the upper wishbone.

I'm making some progress on the rear axle and brakes as well. Can anyone confirm if the rear drum brakes are the same on 6 cyl and V8 Banjo and Salisbary?

I have found a guru who has been doing axle, diff and gearbox mods for 35 years and has a method of changing the flage from LC to HQ-Z on an axle!! In my application, he has guarenteed that I will snap the spline end (corse splin) before I do any damage to the modified flange!! (or blow the diff) What the heck, I'm game!!! I had the pleasure to visit his shop and I must say, It's my idea of what tinker heaven looks like. lol.... WOW!!! Lets just say that being in the game for that many years you would accumulate some stuff!!!

Will keep you posted

Eric

Edited by ribz0, 25 April 2010 - 02:14 PM.

[dattoman]

I'm making some progress on the rear axle and brakes as well. Can anyone confirm if the rear drum brakes are the same on 6 cyl and V8 Banjo and Salisbary?

Which car ?

[ribz0]

I'm making some progress on the rear axle and brakes as well. Can anyone confirm if the rear drum brakes are the same on 6 cyl and V8 Banjo and Salisbary?

Which car ?

Hi ya..

Well, I'm getting the original LC torana axle flanges converter to HQ. He uses two axles and makes one good one. (1xHJ and 1xLC axle) I am fitting HJ 6cyl rear drums (off a banjo) but the backing plates are a bit average. I have a Salisbury V8 diff with better backing plates and was wondering if the rear drum brakes on it was the same as a 6cyl banjo? I have not had a chance to pull them off the Salisbury diff yet to have a look.

Thanks

[dattoman]

Same same

[ribz0]

Same same

I'm using a guy in Mandurah. Not the same guy is he?? His name is Bill.

[dattoman]

errr.... I'm not doing the same

I mean the brakes are the same on both diffs

[ribz0]

errr.... I'm not doing the same

I mean the brakes are the same on both diffs

LOL.... sorry (blond moment) Thanks for that. Thats saves a bit of work for me.

[ribz0]

Dave, I have another one for you.

Just been tinkering and had a look at the steering arms. Not even close to the numbers you said the LC should have so god knows what I have!! The number on one of the steering arms is M8528. Have not got to the other one yet. Can you tell me what this is off please?

Things have progressed well and will post up soon.

Eric

[ribz0]

Hi all

Well, things are coming along now and I think I have the front disc brakes sorted.

What I ended up doing was using the torana stub axles. The main reason was that the caliper was hitting the top wishbone with the HJ stubs and I did not want to grind the top wishbone. Using the HJ stubs lifted the the caliper mounting point which causes the caliper to hit.

This is the LHS with HJ stub. Caliper up high.



This is the RHS with Torana stub. Caliper clears top wishbone



I had the rotor machined down 6mm, (12 MM total diameter) and had to grind down the section between the caliper mounting holes on the stub as this section is raised.



Also had to do some grinding on the HJ caliper so it would clear the steering arm.





All mated up great!



I also ended up cutting the lower bump stop mount off and grinding the bottom edge of the the outer brake pad so it would not hit the hub of the rotor.



I'm pretty happy with how it all turned out. I will retain all HJ braking, master cylinder, proportion valve, front disc set up and rear drum brakes. Now to the rear brakes!