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paint grip 253

Started by _pocock_ , Jul 15 2012 06:53 PM

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#1 _pocock_

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Posted 15 July 2012 - 06:53 PM

any one had anything to do with henkel paint grip 253 . you can apparently apply it to bare metal and
leave it for up to six months or more and when your ready to paint you just give it a wipe over and clean with w&g remover and paint straight over it most paint companys will garentee there products over it scored some the other day from a friend who reckons it is the best stuff ever made sound alot easier then using deoxidine ,, just apply the 253 and leave it on there no washing sandind or worrying
about getting it in crevices so the paint wont stick sounds great


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#2 _Bomber Watson_

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Posted 15 July 2012 - 07:05 PM

Never herd of it, i suggest doing some tests before using it on anything good.

Cheers.

#3 _Quagmire_

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Posted 15 July 2012 - 07:10 PM

so it's a rust converter/protector all in one
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#4 Ruts

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Posted 15 July 2012 - 10:09 PM

I bought two 20 litre drums not long ago. It is the ants pants. Adam Lebrese uses it on his projects. It can be put on with a water spray bottle.

#5 _Bomber Watson_

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Posted 15 July 2012 - 10:11 PM

Do you follow usual bare metal priming operations with it??

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#6 _pocock_

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Posted 15 July 2012 - 10:39 PM

yeah i was told its not really a rust converter as such. it will work on light surface rust, more a rust preventitive and metal conditioner it is also promotes paint adhesion, ,, i was told to apply to clean bare metal and it will seal it. then you can apply your primer straight over the top of it . maybe ruts might have more imformation on how and what he uses it on



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#7 shadey1963

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Posted 15 July 2012 - 11:31 PM

Here some tech info

http://www.solvents.net.au/index_htm_files/PAINTGRIP%20253%20(212997).pdf

#8 Ruts

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Posted 16 July 2012 - 08:11 PM

I was put onto this product by a local panel beater who specialises in restoring Alpha's to concourse condition. After he gets a body blasted he coats it with Paint grip by applying it with a simple water spray bottle. When dried, bare metal panels can be stored for any amount of time without corrosion forming. My friend has had bare metal panels stored for a up 3 years. You can paint straight over it and can even apply body filler over the top. I must admit I have not used it yet myself but I have seen plenty of body panels and shells covered in it and have seen repairs done over the top. Whenever you seen bare metal cars displayed at car shows you can bet they have been treated with Paint Grip 253 to prevent any corrosion forming.

#9 _pocock_

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Posted 16 July 2012 - 10:47 PM

yeah sounds good ,, i spoke to the guys at henkel who make the stuff, they told me that it is not a rust converter it is actually
an epoxy solvent coating,, that will prevent rust for up to 6 months indoors . and it is wise to just wipe any bare metal panels over with a metal conditioner/ rust converter, like deoxidine wipe on leave it a minute or two then wipe off with a metho soaked rag then dry with a dry rag let surface dry properly and apply the paint grip 253 and you should be sweet he said some times when sanding metal with wire wheels or discs there can be rust in the small scratches on the surface of the bare metal you wont see. so the deoxidine will just get rid of it before applying the 253 dont know if he is right or not

#10 TerrA LX

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Posted 17 July 2012 - 08:38 AM

Deoxidine (rust converter) should be neutralised with plain water, the metho is used after to dry the water if needed.

#11 _pocock_

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Posted 17 July 2012 - 10:04 AM

yeah i know thats whats it says on the data sheet ,,but thats what the guy from henkel said to do, lol seems they can not agree
on the right procedure

#12 TerrA LX

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Posted 17 July 2012 - 10:13 AM

Deoxidine is diluted phosphoric acid, only water will neutralise it.

#13 _RichoX1_

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Posted 17 July 2012 - 10:46 AM

Yeh now this seems very strange i have fist hand appearance with this proceeder and have seem 2 different results using water and using Wax grease remover all-so thinners
1 with water 5 min after neutralizing the panels re Oxadises back up in patches
2 with W&G remover no Oxadising
3 with thinners no more Oxadising

It seems to defeat the perpose of deOxadising the panle when whater intantly Oxidises it once more

#14 TerrA LX

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Posted 17 July 2012 - 03:25 PM

AFIK The orange tinge you see is not oxidising, it is part of the process.

#15 _pocock_

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Posted 17 July 2012 - 10:39 PM

a chemist told me the same thing as terralx says that only water will neutralize these phosphoric acid based products a lot of guys do use metho thinners and w&g remover but does it neutrilize the acid, i agree it seems strange to put water on bare metal , but in saying that they are generally 60 to 70 percent water any way straight out the bottle i think the secret is when you neutrilize the acid with water dry it off immediatly i generally give it a light sand as well before painting

pocock

#16 _RichoX1_

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 12:41 AM

AFIK The orange tinge you see is not oxidising, it is part of the process.

im really not confident that this water is the right method described in the process, its a definite Oxidation that starts again its just common sense to see that water on bear mettle corrosion starts even just being exposed to the air rust starts developing.
brown patches start showing up all over the panels
Hear is another example there is a type of deoxidizer that has some material in it that when it drys it leaves a plastic like film, there for seals it from the air, thus removing it with water doesn't work only thinners will do it

Edited by RichoX1, 18 July 2012 - 12:53 AM.

#17 _pocock_

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Posted 18 July 2012 - 10:43 PM

yeah not real sure but as i said i was told only water will , neutrilize the acid , and when you apply the acid (deoxidine) it forms a coating on the bare metal that wont allow the water to affect ,,it that you use to wash it off. with i have also been told that the ginger or brownish effect that comes up on the metal after washing it down with water is not rust but part of the chemical reaction and is not a problem a lot of guys who do full on restos use the water method i guess what ever works stick with it

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