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186 Engine Rebuild

Started by _duggan208_ , Feb 18 2015 12:34 AM

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#101 Shtstr

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 09:23 PM

Comes down to purpose of the car.

#102 _Bomber Watson_

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 09:42 PM

Street, heavy is more drivealbe. 

Drag, heavy is faster. 

Autocross, Heavy is better. 

Hillclimb, Heavy is generally better. 

Circuit, debatable. 


Speedway, well no one talks about that one toothed cousin marrying member of the family so who cares which is faster. 
 


#103 S pack

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Posted 26 July 2017 - 09:46 PM

149, 161, 179, 186 and 186s forged steel crank same part for all engines.

138, 161, 173 and 186 nodular cast iron crank same part for all engines.


#104 Shtstr

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Posted 27 July 2017 - 11:33 AM

Well said bomber and yes i do come from a speedway game and stopped racing after my father passed away in 2001. But i don't have one tooth i have a full set of teeth and in speedway you need an engine that can rev fast drop rpm fast and go again and be reliable.

#105 _Bomber Watson_

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Posted 27 July 2017 - 09:49 PM

149, 161, 179, 186 and 186s forged steel crank same part for all engines.

138, 161, 173 and 186 nodular cast iron crank same part for all engines.

 

Just quoting this because its accurate. 


#106 _duggan208_

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Posted 26 August 2017 - 01:17 AM

I have decided to keep the 186 mainly because I did not want to have to get an engineers cert for the 202 in the LC. There may be some advantages for the 186 block, but if that's true I would think those advantages would be extremely small. Anyway as a street car I'm looking for a lot of every thing, a good balance, although, it will not be a long distance cruiser and definatly not a daily user. Very interesting about the 138 crank. I thought that all of the 3 inch cranks were exactly the same, except for the iron and steel. I'am also building up a 192 for my HR ute, I might look into that.

I have my crank back from being ground and it has now lost about 3 Kg from all of the frocking grinding, measuring, grinding, measuring and sanding of those frocking counterweights, looks good though, the machinist calls it a pretty crank. I just might even get 1 HP extra. Anyway if there is any gain from putting one's self through that kind of frustration of the shaping of counterweights I have it. the crank now weighs in at 24.7 Kg. my air box is now finally in the stage were i have to make it a lot more presentable. Off for balancing next and I need to machine a little of the top of the pistons, they stick up about 13 thou, so I don't need to use a shim anymore. Get the hole in the timing cover welded up, I dont have the gear to weld alloy, I had to cut off the timing mount were the marks are cast in as they hit the ATI balancer.  

regards 

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#107 _duggan208_

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Posted 14 November 2017 - 10:37 PM

I've started on my 6 into 1 headers. I've mounted the merge collector to the block. Very bloody tight, fishs a/hole. I've actually got 3 pipes tacked together, 3 to go. Had to order more mandrel bends to finish. I'll put up a pic of all the tacked pipes when finished.

Regards

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#108 warrenm

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 05:25 AM

What length primary pipes are you using?


#109 _duggan208_

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Posted 15 November 2017 - 11:10 PM

The first, second and the last pipes are all 690mm long. I hope i can get the other pipes the same length. I didn't want to make then too short as it is a road car. There is bugger all room to do any real tuning of lengths, so I'm hoping any tuning effects will come in at around the higher point of the mid range.

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#110 warrenm

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 05:49 AM

It's going to be a "challenge" to get 6 pipes to finish where you have the merge, a bit further down & the "K" member becomes an issue. Good luck & keep the pics coming.


#111 _duggan208_

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 10:45 PM

Thanks mate, I'm going to need it. I've tacked up 1,2 and 6, each pipe gets harder to make fit and to keep them at around 690mm is a real pain in the arse. i also cut the old modified H&M pipes off the flanges and filed out the flanges so they exactly fit the ports.

Regards 


#112 _duggan208_

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 10:18 PM

This is where I'm up to now. I've got some more mandrel bends, so lots of the Queens language and cursing.

Regards

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#113 _duggan208_

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Posted 08 December 2017 - 10:40 PM

1 more 690 mm pipe to go. Get some springs for the collector and then weld a 3 inch flange on. Lots of frocken grinding.

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#114 jd lj

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 06:10 AM

You're a dedicated man. Tackling your air box and then this requires a lot of patients. I'm sure it'll be worthwhile though. I bet other people tell you that your crazy and have too much time on your hands. That's what I kept hearing as a worked away on my air box,I'm glad that I did it though, I think it's a great improvement.

James

#115 _duggan208_

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Posted 10 December 2017 - 09:39 PM

Yes to the above. Although its more of a case of bugger all money at the moment, so every thing takes a lot of time to do to; may as well use the time to tackle hard jobs. As for crazy well, I'm crazy enough to try to establish an automotive art business but really getting no where. I take it that you have finished your air box and testing it to see how it works. I did follow the thread, have not seen it for a while. how is it going?

regards


#116 jd lj

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Posted 11 December 2017 - 04:32 AM

Yes, my air box is finished and has been up and running since early this year. I've connected my outlet hose from my catch can to the backing plate so that now I've got some air flow through the PCV system but that's the only additional work that I've done. Luckily all the careful planning has paid off and I had no unforeseen problems to sort out later.

I drove around 600km return trip to toranafest and it's all good. The air box received plenty of interest whilst there.

I'm still tempted to connect it to the outside of the engine bay via some ducting and get some cooler air going in, but that's just an idea at the moment.

James

#117 _duggan208_

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Posted 14 December 2017 - 10:53 PM

The more ideas the better, some kind of a way out scoop. I'm going to toy around with a Magna rear window brake light body. Get rid of the light and it may make a different bonnet scoop. Yes my airbox attempts always attracted attention as well. I've thought about using the inner guard, above the front wheel, maybe and inwards facing on the side guard scoop, plenty of cold air into a box behind the inner guard and then into the engine bay air box. Good to hear your airbox is a success.

regards  


#118 _duggan208_

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Posted 15 December 2017 - 10:54 PM

Finally tacked up the last pipe. Lots of finish welding and grinding to be done now, springs to hold on the collector and weld on the flange, not to mention painting and surface grinding. I'll never have a winge about header prices again after doing this.

 

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#119 jd lj

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Posted 17 December 2017 - 07:16 AM

That's a work of art there Jon, well done.

After I'd made my air box I came up with the idea that I could have ducted it down through the inner guard where the battery used to be, but that idea came to me too late. I'd also thought of getting an air filter housing box from a commodore and positioning that where the battery tray used to be and connecting the air box to that. The idea would have been to then duct the commodore air filter box through the inner guard. This could have looked factory correct kind of by having Holden genuine parts fitted.

Another idea was to duct it through the side of the stone tray so that I wasn't cutting into any welded on body panels. The ducting for this idea would probably benefit from having a heat shield due to the heat from the engine block and hot air from the radiator.

I think that if you draw cool air from under the inner guard that having a baffle to deflect debris coming off the tyre from reaching the intake would be worthwhile.

Yet another idea was I was wondering how the bonnet would look with a set of early monaro bonnet vents/scoops to allow cool air into the engine bay. Once again this would be using genuine Holden type/design and period correct parts.

#120 _Bomber Watson_

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Posted 17 December 2017 - 06:29 PM

All of your ideas are brilliant bar the last. 

The bonnet would certainly not look good with early Monraro bonet vents. 


#121 jd lj

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Posted 17 December 2017 - 08:20 PM

That's ok, it was never anything more than just a thought that I had to get cooler air into the engine bay.

#122 _duggan208_

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Posted 17 December 2017 - 10:56 PM

I think that the Monaro vents are likely to not grab much air for a significant gain. There was a bloke up here who had the XA GT bonnet scoops in a LJ bonnet, didn't look to bad because they sit flush in the bonnet. I suppose you could duct that air to a box. I can sort of remember reading an article about World War 2 fighter planes had this type of scoop, they only really worked at some serious high speed, but having said that you regularly see these scoops in the windows of V8 Super cars.

I can remember that a US muscle car had foward facing scoops in the front guard, can't remember which one it was. Early Mustangs had these scoops in the quarter panels. Might have been a Trans Am. There would have to be a sealed compartment in the inner guard that the scoop pulled cold air into. making that look good would be a challenge and a half.

Regards


#123 _duggan208_

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Posted 17 December 2017 - 10:58 PM

Actually, XA GTs had foward facing scoops in the front guards, I wonder if they could pull in enough cold air.

regards


#124 _duggan208_

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Posted 07 April 2018 - 10:48 PM

Here is a couple of new pics. I've added something different to the stone tray. The bottom nose is a little bit smaller than the top and the bumper bar. Can't really tell how its gonna look till its finished and painted black.

While I stuff around with the engine its a good time to do some more stuffing around with the cross member. I'm gonna seem weld all of the joints, fix the shitey mod to the left hand engine mount, the previous owner attacked it when he put in a set of H&M headers, cut some material off the V8 strengthening plate on the bottom of the cross member, after all its only a 6 and the cross member may not need that sort of extra strength. A medium Makita diet taking care of not drilling any spot welds out. It weighs 25 KGs, so the fat bastard needs to loose a little weight. 

I've decided to add about 12mm to the bottom of the sump to clear the ARP studs and girdle. I can add a full windage tray scraping off some oil and diverting it back down to the pick up and I may as well stuff around with some trap doors. I also have to make up a fat pick up tube to feed the external oil line to the pump. I'm even gonna play around with some cooling fins on the bottom part of the sump and a scoop under the X member to blow air through the fins, worth a try. Moved the drain plug so that during a change all of the oil will drain out and not leave any dreggs in the bottom of the sump. 

And after heaps of the Queens finest language I've finished my 6 into 1 headers. Just need to refinish them either paint or ceramic coating.

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#125 _duggan208_

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Posted 05 May 2018 - 10:53 PM

I've finally finished Jenny Craiging my x member. I only thought I'd get a couple of KGs at the most. I ended up getting almost 4 KGs out. When I add up the couple of hundred grams out of the sway bar mounts and the out rigger strengthening mounts It will be really close to 4 KG. I will have little plastic plugs for every hole. I managed to leave the hole saw in the tool box and stick to more, much smaller holes. I have drilled the upper wish bone mounting points 15mm (5/8) lower and there is not much meat left, so I welded in some extra gussets and some more in around the engine mounts. The whole dam x member is also totally seam welded. Now its off to the powder coaters, not bloody cheap, but money well spent.   

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