23 replies to this topic

[MR77LX]

I need some advice please. 

 

I fitted new brake lines to my LX torana and some of the lines keep on leaking from the nut end. 

 

Im running a distribution block inside my guard. I have flared all my lines as well. 

 

Today i pulled out the lines out and took them to my local spare parts place and the guy re flared them for me.  

 

I re fitted them back on and they are still leaking. Its soo messy 

 

I don't now what else i can do? 

 

 

[rodomo]

Brake lines should be double flared if that makes sense?

[TerrA LX]

Do you have the correct flange nuts?

Some are straight, some are tapered?

[MR77LX]

All my flares are a double flare. 

 

yes i do have the correct tool. They are on pretty tight. 

 

I have even loosened them of and re tightened them a few times just in case there not sitting on right. 

 

My garage floor is a mess from all the brake fluid. 

 

Can it be the brake fluid? im using a dot 4. However the other connections that i flared up are not leaking. 

 

They hold pressure fine, but when i pump the brake pedal, it takes about 10 pumps before they start seeping. 

[dattoman]

What tubing did you use ?

[MR77LX]

The taper on the distro block looks clean with no scores. 

I used steel tubing 

[ls2lxhatch]

A photo of the distribution block ports and the flare may help identify the problem.

[MR77LX]

This is a picture of the distribution block when i first started. I dont have any current pics but i can take some tomorrow.

 

Attached Files

•  dis.jpg   83.71K   9 downloads

[71xu1]

By any stretch I'm no brake expert, but I did have the same problem once. It ended up being over flared double flares. On the second flaring don't go so hard attach them and let the nut finish the flare of to the block, wheel cylinder etc.

[dattoman]

That green coated Protex brake tubing is too hard and I won't use it

Its hard to get a good flare and has no crushability so things leak often

 

I'd say if you used a different brand of pipe you'd have better luck

I prefer to use a brand called Reliance

It comes from BPA QLD. 

http://www.bpa.com.au/default.htm

[S pack]

By any stretch I'm no brake expert, but I did have the same problem once. It ended up being over flared double flares. On the second flaring don't go so hard attach them and let the nut finish the flare of to the block, wheel cylinder etc.

Esp if the distribution block is second hand and the flare seats are marked from previous brake pipe installations.

[MR77LX]

Today i took the lines back out and cleaned them and re fitted them back in. 

 

They still leaked however after i re tightened them to the max the leak stooped. 

 

Now i bled the rear brakes and that went all good. Tried to bleed the front and no fluid is coming out from front calipers  

 

I cant believe my luck! After hours of work, i figured that the front lines must be on the wrong way on the distribution block. 

 

Before i pull them out can some one please tell me if they are going into the right holes on the distribution block, 

 

I have attached some pictures. 

 

I think front RH side and front LH side should be switched. 

 

 

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•  d3.jpg   267.95K   4 downloads
•  d4.jpg   103.11K   8 downloads

[ls2lxhatch]

Your sealing problem could be in the ports of the distribution block.

 

When the tube nuts are tightened either the flare on the tube has to deform to seal on the convex seat in the distribution block or the convex seat in the distribution block has to deform to seal against the flare on the tube or both.

 

As the distribution block is alloy and the flare is steel then it is the convex seat in the distribution block that will deform. If the convex seat was badly deformed by the previous brake lines then you can have difficulty getting it to seal with the new brake lines. Brake lines made out of the softer bright zinc finish bundy tube or cunifer bundy tube will be easier to seal. If you look at the convex seats in the distribution block you will be able to see the impression left on the convex seat by the flare on the tube.

 

 

The distribution block has two separate circuits with a brake fail switch between them to sense a difference in fluid pressure between the two circuits. The master cylinder will have a front brake circuit and a rear brake circuit. The front brake circuit  of the master cylinder is typically the one with the largest reservoir. It can be the front or rear depending on the master cylinder design.

 

The front circuit has three ports as long as you have the front left, front right and front brake circuit of the master cylinder connected to the ports is does not matter what order they are in.

 

The rear circuit has two ports, rear brake master cylinder in and rear out, again the order makes no difference.

 

You appear to have the wrong brake fail switch screwed into the distribution block. The plastic switch only suits the late LX distribution block proportioning valve. The correct switch for your distribution block is the single pin metal switch. If you examine the switches you will see the metal switch has a longer and thinner pin. You can machine up a pin extension for the plastic switch if you want to use it with the distribution block.

 

The dual pin plastic switch was introduced to meet an ADR31 that required a separate brake fail warning light. One of the pins is the earth for the warning light and the other is a switched earth from the ignition switch for testing the warning light circuit and globe.

Edited by ls2lxhatch, 18 July 2015 - 02:06 PM.

[ls2lxhatch]

Link to post by Dr Terry regarding the brake fail switch changes.

http://www.gmh-toran...on/#entry406411

[MR77LX]

The front brake lines, which hole d they connect to on the master cylinder? Front or back hole?

The brake fail switch is the original one that was in the car. I got rid f the prop valve and removed the switch and used it in the distribution block. The harness and switch are the originals.

[ls2lxhatch]

http://www.gmh-toran...on/#entry406411The front brake lines, which hole d they connect to on the master cylinder? Front or back hole?

 
Depends on which master cylinder you are using. Take a picture.
 

The brake fail switch is the original one that was in the car. I got rid f the prop valve and removed the switch and used it in the distribution block. The harness and switch are the originals.

 
The plastic brake fail switch and the metal brake fail switch are not interchangeable without modification. They will screw in but they won't work. The HQ/LJ distribution block is designed for the metal brake fail switch. There are two versions of the LH/LX combination distribution block and proportioning valve.
 
Have a read of this post.
 
Dr Terry regarding the brake fail switch changes.
http://www.gmh-toran...on/#entry406411
 




Use distribution block vs NOS. Note the deformation of the convex seat.

Used top, NOS bottom.

Edited by ls2lxhatch, 18 July 2015 - 03:30 PM.

[MR77LX]

Do rare spares sell the metal brake switch?

I'm running a factory standard master cylinder.
The bigger nut on the master cylinder connects up to my front brakes.

[S pack]

There were many different factory master cylinders. 

 

YOu have the brake lines from the master mixed up. The bigger nut is always rear brakes. 

 

Cheers. 

Agree, the m/cyl port that takes the larger nut is the rear brakes.

The factory original cast iron m/cyl on the 1977 LX had the reservoirs swapped around so the front brake line port was closest to the brake booster.

 

I believe the brake fail switch changed to the two wire type at the same time.

Edited by S pack, 18 July 2015 - 07:54 PM.

[MR77LX]

So if my lines on the master are on the wrong way around, can that be a reason why no fluid would come out from my front calipers. 

 

The rear calipers have fluid coming out when i undo the brake nipple. 

 

I have attached below the part number of my master cylinder. Also a picture of my master, the front nut goes into the front brake lines on the distribution block. (refer to previous pic at top)  

 

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•  p2.jpg   52.63K   2 downloads