29 replies to this topic

[xu2308]

Harry Firth in a letter to me says that Leo Pruneau and Fred James said that Two V8's were fitted online, so two pilot cars, and the Production Cars were only two weeks off Production.

 

GMH Stopped the Program on the 13/7/1972

 

Now on the GMH LJ Torana Warranty Disc this is a LJ GTR Torana

 

Built 11/7/1972  Two Days before GMH Head Office canned the Program

PSN  L207833

Engine Number QT183600  308 V8

 

Sold 11/1972

 

Dealer Number 165 ??????????? Who is this Dealer ?????????????????????????????????

 

I believe this is one of the Pilot Cars, remember the 3-LJ GTR Prototypes that GMH Port Melbourne  Experimental Engineering did were the Pre-Production Cars and the Bathurst Race Cars, just to not confuse here.

 

I will have to suss the Warranty Disc to find the other Pilot Car, it maybe a Brisbane Built Car due to both factory's were going to build the V8 LJ's

 

AL

Edited by xu2308, 28 August 2016 - 08:57 PM.

[xu2308]

Bazza

Have you spotted the other LJ car in your research on the Warranty Disc.

[xu2308]

Warranty Disc Screen Shot

 

 

11/7/1972  L207833  T183600  11.72  165   Screenshot (82).png   69.97K   6 downloads

Edited by xu2308, 28 August 2016 - 09:25 PM.

[N/A-PWR]

Cool as Al,

 

 

Like button for you

[xu2308]

So  this LJ GTR on the Warranty Disc should get round that stupid NCOP as there was a Factory Line Car Built, I wonder where this LJ GTR is.

[xu2308]

From what i was told, back in the Day. GMH did two Pilot cars on the Production Lines and then sent them to GMH Port Melbourne then Experimental Engineering ran and tested them to iron out the bugs and if all ok the Production Cars got the go ahead. So the time date on this LJ GTR is about right for that, and WHO is Dealer 165 ????

[Bazza]

From what i was told, back in the Day. GMH did two Pilot cars on the Production Lines and then sent them to GMH Port Melbourne then Experimental Engineering ran and tested them to iron out the bugs and if all ok the Production Cars got the go ahead. So the time date on this LJ GTR is about right for that, and WHO is Dealer 165 ????

 

I can only find that one dealer 165 on the disc. It has a '4' in the zone indicating South Australia. I am wondering if it might be dealer 265 (GMH Public Relations).

 

Bazza

[xu2308]

Dealer 165 may be for these Pilot Cars

[xu2308]

I can only find that one dealer 165 on the disc. It has a '4' in the zone indicating South Australia. I am wondering if it might be dealer 265 (GMH Public Relations).

 

Bazza

As it was Built at the Adelaide Plant, then its the Adelaide Pilot Car.  Going off the Engine Number starting with a T on the Warranty Disc then its a QT Donk.  Hope this LJ GTR surfaces down the track.

[Tyre biter]

You are a sleuth Al.

So, to be clear, there are the three LJ GTR XU1 V8 prototypes: a SMP car (yours), a Mustard coloured car (sorry I don't know its correct name) and a white coloured one - correct?

And you are saying that in addition there are also two 'pre-production' cars - correct?

Amazing how this all comes out some 44 years after the event.

Cheers, TB  

[S pack]

GMH Stopped the Program on the 13/7/1972

 

AL                         

Are you sure Al. Everything I've read about the supercar scare says it was the 30th June 1972 when GMH canned the V8 XU1 program.  

 

[S pack]

Think I found the other V8 car.

11/07/72  82469 L207808  T185350  DLR 918 Zone 3.

 

Or it could be

11/07/72  82911 L208128  R163646  76203EO DLR 000X

Edited by S pack, 29 August 2016 - 09:29 AM.

[xu2308]

Are you sure Al. Everything I've read about the supercar scare says it was the 30th June 1972 when GMH canned the V8 XU1 program.  
 

The official Date was Friday the 13 July 1972, going from the Newspaper Press release, 25/6/1972 was the 160MPH Super Car Headline in the SMH, the 30/6/1972 date you put up was GMH first comment about it, not the Program was stopped.

[AbsynthHatch]

So on the second car Dave listed QR163646 does this make it a 253?

[xu2308]

You are a sleuth Al.

So, to be clear, there are the three LJ GTR XU1 V8 prototypes: a SMP car (yours), a Mustard coloured car (sorry I don't know its correct name) and a white coloured one - correct?

And you are saying that in addition there are also two 'pre-production' cars - correct?

Amazing how this all comes out some 44 years after the event.

Cheers, TB  

The White and Strike me Pink and Lone o Ranger LJ GTR's were the Pre Production Cars and Bathurst Race Cars that GMH Experimental Engineering put the 308's in. Harry in a letter to me says that Leo and Fred James said that Two V8's were fitted online to Test Production Tooling, now going from that I would take it (online) is at the Factory. They were only two weeks off Production, one would assume that they would of done a Pilot Run Car, its interesting there is a LJ GTR on the Warranty Disc with a T at the start of the Engine Number, T was used for 308's back then QT=308 HT=308 WT=308 Etc Etc.

 

Unless they could test the Tooling online at GMH Port Melbourne Experimental Engineering, then they are talking the 3-Prototype LJ GTR's and not LJ's at the Adelaide or Brisbane Factory.

[xu2308]

Think I found the other V8 car.

11/07/72  82469 L207808  T185350  DLR 918 Zone 3.

 

Or it could be

11/07/72  82911 L208128  R163646  76203EO DLR 000X

 

82469 is a 4Cyl 4-Door Dave, so that must be a Typo for sure

the other car the 82911 Could be the second car with a 253 V8 with a R Engine Code, or are they all Typo errors you think ????

I could be wrong Dave and they are all Typo's and as they are all on the 11/7/1972, maybe the person who did the warranty listing had a hang over on that day 

 

Leo and Fred with testing the Tooling online could mean at Experimental Engineering at Port Melbourne and then it is only the 3-GTR Prototypes they are talking about.

Edited by xu2308, 29 August 2016 - 11:18 AM.

[yel327]

Possibly not typos AL but the engine number against the wrong PSN. Will explain when I get a chance.

[rodomo]

You are a sleuth Al.

I've said it before and I'll say it again................Like a dog with a bone! Good on you Al!

[xu2308]

Haaaaa Rodomo

 

They might be Typo's and i could be wrong here, but its interesting for sure.

[rodomo]

Mate.......through out the years, you have been the super sleuth on these cars.................and there have been knockers along the way...........but you have stuck with it!

[Balfizar]

Harry Firth in a letter to me says that Leo Pruneau and Fred James said that Two V8's were fitted online, so two pilot cars, and the Production Cars were only two weeks off Production.

 

GMH Stopped the Program on the 13/7/1972

 

Now on the GMH LJ Torana Warranty Disc this is a LJ GTR Torana

 

Built 11/7/1972  Two Days before GMH Head Office canned the Program

PSN  L207833

Engine Number QT183600  308 V8

 

Sold 11/1972

 

Dealer Number 165 ??????????? Who is this Dealer ?????????????????????????????????

 

I believe this is one of the Pilot Cars, remember the 3-LJ GTR Prototypes that GMH Port Melbourne  Experimental Engineering did were the Pre-Production Cars and the Bathurst Race Cars, just to not confuse here.

 

I will have to suss the Warranty Disc to find the other Pilot Car, it maybe a Brisbane Built Car due to both factory's were going to build the V8 LJ's

 

AL

One of the most interesting people to talk to would have been the production scheduler from the day.

 

What was the lead time on the supply of V8 componentry.

Differentials

propeller shafts

Radiators

suspension springs

and any thing else that was V8 specific.

What was the intended run length of V8's

 

and what did they do with all the supplied components? that were not used. (LH/LX?)

 

There should be more of a trail left behind than I have seen so far for full production.

 

By the way, D/CD 165 is most likely a cost centre  (internal GMH)

Edited by Balfizar, 29 August 2016 - 09:41 PM.

[xu2308]

​Harry said they were only two weeks off Production, so ummmm they must of had the items at the Plant for the go ahead one would think. My guess the what ever amount of Engines they had there, would of been put in HQ Holden's or put in the Spare Parts Bin.

 

The first batch of V8 LJ's was 210, then after that it was Batches of 150 depending on Demand, so Wheels Magazine reported in Wheels Within.

Edited by xu2308, 29 August 2016 - 09:52 PM.

[Balfizar]

​Harry said they were only two weeks off Production, so ummmm they must of had the items at the Plant for the go ahead one would think. My guess the what ever amount of Engines they had there, would of been put in HQ Holden's or put in the Spare Parts Bin.

 

The first batch of V8 LJ's was 210, then after that it was Batches of 150 depending on Demand, so Wheels Magazine reported in Wheels Within.

What was the lead time on Lang Lang?  Probably still 6 months minimum even if only testing the inclusion of a V8.

I have seen no paper trail, nor have I seen any come to the surface in the last 44 years,  but then again!

Concept/experimental/pilot  absolutely,  production is unsubstantiated, perhaps discussion will flush something out.  We live in hope.

All the tooling and componentry for 210 cars would have been a huge loss for GMH.

[xu2308]

Street Machine Magazine in Sept 1990 issue on the V8 LJ, in there story they said the Media of the time said that GMH lost $200,000 on the Cars, There is a Full Parts List for XW7 V8 LJ and 22 Engineering Instructional Drawings as well. So if the Parts list was done then the parts must of been done. Get the Sept 1990 issue of Street Machine, a Contractor that did the Engineering Drawings, supplied the info to Street Machine as in the Parts List for XW7 and the Instructional Drawings for them to look at for the story.

[a9x868]

very very interesting al!

great work so far