24 replies to this topic

[Cook]

Hi all,  I am looking at a list of components provided by my intended engine builder and he has included some manufacturer options.  I haven't spoken with him yet to discuss pros and cons but curious to hear what you may have to say about the different brands, if that makes sense.

 

His brief is:

308 (QT) block stroked to 355ci

looking to get 450 - 500 hp at the flywheel

It will only be used as a cruiser

has to be driveable

 

Cheers Ron

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[Redslur]

Howdy.

 

Only thing I would change is the crank from Scat to COME. Much better cranks.  I have had several 355's all with COME cranks and all above 450+hp and spinning to big revs.

 

Choice of cam for me is Crane as they are tried and tested. A F288 solid will get you 500hp with VN heads.  An F280 will get you around the 450hp mark. 

 

Great little engines....

[Lima31]

Not sure you'd need the oil pump conversion, the std pump with some mods is plenty for the street.

 

Crow do good custom cams.  If you have the budget go hydraulic roller.  Guess it depends what heads / compression etc.

 

Switching to a Romac RO0220SA would save about 2 kg on the rotating assembly.

 

Wiseco also make decent pistons.

[Cook]

Thanks for the feedback gents.  I will take these on-board when I meet with him next to finalise the build.  Cheers Ron

[koalasprint]

Hi Ron, some other components not mentioned but key to the build:-
Cylinder heads? (VN or YT-3 or Torque Power CNC)
Inlet manifold (TP dual plane high rise)
Carby (Holley Ultra DP 750)
Sump? (ASR)
What machine work is going to be done to the block, any oil mods, main bearing work? (ARP studs as a minimum for intended HP)
Ignition system? (ICE/MSD)

Compression ratio? Which needs to be matched to the camshaft.

I don't think that those roller rockers are adjustable? So the valve train geometry and push rods length will need to be spot on. If ever you want to change to a solid cam then the rockers will need to be changed. Consider upgrading to adjustable rockers.

Agree with Lima31 on the oil pump. Modding the standard pump adds volume and pressure without adding load to the pump drive gears.

All of the other brands listed look good to me.

Cheers, Steve.

Edited by koalasprint, 29 March 2019 - 07:44 AM.

[Cook]

Thanks Steve,

 

I didn't mention some of those other components but here they are:

Harrop dual plane inlet manifold

VN heads

Holley Avenger 770cfm carby

ASR sump

Ignition system - undecided but leaning toward ICE.

Comp ratio - aiming for 10:1.

 

As you thought those rockers aren't adjustable but I think I will stick with them to keep within budget.  I understand adjustable isn't mush more expensive but the additional work to accommodate them is.  I don't believe there is any "additional" work being done to the block etc. beside some port matching with the manifold.  Have dropped the Mopar oil pump to a hi flow pump.

 

The difficulty is finding the right balance for my application, within the budget, and keeping the beast driveable. Thanks again for your input. Cheers Ron 

[Lima31]

On a street budget I would trade in the ICE ignition setup and the hi volume oil pump, and spend the money on oversize cam bearings, head and mains stud kit and the basic mains priority oil mods.

[skap]

What is the budget?

[ozyozyozy]

My 2 cents, i would use the mopar oil pump, dont need high volume, the factory style oil pumps you can buy are mostly sub par, very hit and miss, factory was the best and cant buy new any more.
Dont use the all alloy romac balancer unless your using a heavier flywheel.
For a street cruiser, type of crank is not really a big deal, they will all do the job.
either use the durabond one piece cam bearing or a better option, i have seen really good results with wear using the coated cam bearing, unsure the company name.
770 carb may be a touch big, depending on what rpm engine can do.
For a cruiser, hydraulic flat tappet or better but more expensive hydraulic roller cam, less periodic maintenance.

[Big_Red]

I watched a YouTube vid some American guys did a comparison on different sized holleys. They had a 383 stroker SBC and used carbs all the way from a 500-1050cfm (from memory) there was very little gain from a 650 to a 750, over this Mark there was 1-3hp gained peak. The smaller carb should be more Streetable and make better power down low as it would have better air speed. I guess don't over cam or carb it and it will be a nice motor.

Edited by Big_Red, 30 March 2019 - 07:08 PM.

[gtrboyy]

vn rods or i beams...h beams are heavy are overkill for n/a streeter

 

modded std oil pump & oilways etc alot of good tricks on aussiev8 forum,,more about improving flow/volume & fixing common issues.

 

modded factory hei setup will be fine

 

You haven't mentioned diff gears/convertor/intake manifold/budget to get better answers tbh.

 

My vh sle is 10;7cr,f280/vn heads/harrop single plane,recurved hei/holley black  trimatic/4500 stally 4.56 9" drove nice for a weekender/cruiser although tad wild for most people

[Cook]

Thanks again for all the comments and advise.  To be honest I was originally more keen to get feedback on the various manufacturer options listed than build type but appreciate the responses none the less.  To provide some further info FWIW;

budget is ~$10K 

T400 trans and 9 inch diff with 3.50:1 ratio. Running 17" wheels

converter will be chosen to suit but not looking to go too big if I can help it

I had bought the carby some years ago and my tuner has said that it may be a bit big for the application but he will see

I agree that ICE ignition is expensive for what I need and that is why I haven't made a decision.  I had forgotten about Performance Ignition Services although I did have some earlier discussions with them so still on the radar

I had mentioned I have a Harrop dual plane intake manifold and will be staying with that to remain under the hood (no bonnet scoop)

Cheers Ron

[Cook]

Thanks Daniel.  Fortunately I bought the block and VN heads some years ago to use to dummy up some things, so as long as they are ok I don't have that cost.  I also have the intake manifold and sump, Cheers Ron 

[Bigfella237]

 ~ Be prepared to go looking at later model blocks (304) as they are more available and often cheaper. I'm using a VS series 2 block which has the advantage of thicker castings due to factory roller rockers and having a blind deck. ~

 

It's probably unlikely to happen but bear in mind that if someone in authority insists on checking for a newer block, you may end up having to meet the emissions standards that applied to the donor car it came from?

 

If that happens you will almost certainly need EFI, catalytic converters and a stock cam to pass the tests.

 

Whereas if you have an earlier block than the car it's going into, it's gonna be a lot easier to meet any standards that applied back in the 70's, if you even get tested at all.

[Cook]

Food for thought Andrew. Cheers Ron

[TK383]

Scat chev journal crank

Scat Pro I beam rods with 7/16" bolts

Mahle pistons are great for a streeter, or CP is also nice, CP do a true flat top for holdens - available through precision.

Romac all steel balancer or powerbond street steel - forget alloy for street use.

Rollmaster red timing kit

Camtech for a flat tappet cam, don't use a shelf grind, get a custom, ask when you need specs.

Nason's sells some nice chilled iron foot flat tappet lifters.

Crane rockers, their energisers will do the job for you.

Stock oil pump modified, the Chrysler pump does not fix the issues because the issues are not with the pump.

ACL race bearings, any king bearings that get supplied by customers here get thrown in the bin or used for dummy up purposes, I will not use king.

Crane is a safe bet for springs/retainers/locks.

 

Harrop dual plane is weak, but I know your dilemma, a COME low rise single plane is a good alternative, I built a street 383 a couple of months ago with pocket port VN heads, baby hyd roller cam, COME intake & 750 carb - made 480hp & lacked nothing down low.

[Bigfella237]

As I said, it's most likely that you'll get some govt key tapper that couldn't tell the difference between a HT Brougham and a VT Commodore block to save themselves, so long as nothing flags on their computer screen they couldn't care less.

 

I'm just saying if they do discover that the engine in a 1976 Torana is from a 1999 Commodore they may want to see more than a charcoal canister!

[koalasprint]

i'm in Victoria and the car is on H plates. I changed my engine block for a 11QT(Statesman) block to a VT(1984 VK Commodore) with no issues. All I had to do was get a letter signed by the club verifying that the engine was period correct. I know, stunningly sensible huh.

[Bigfella237]

If your Keen, You could deck a Late Model block, Buy a worn out 60+ over Red Block with a Good number and then get Creative with a Die Grinder and Letter/Number stamps...

 

Then lube up your arse cause you're about to be somebody's bitch for the next 3 to 5 years!