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T56 Mal Woods Fitment


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#1 LH8VD69

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Posted 04 July 2019 - 07:46 PM

Ok, for reasons I may reveal later I have been forced to change directions on gearbox selection. I’ve been reading some old posts about both the TKO and T56 box from Mal Woods. The whole 3rd gear thing has thrown me off the TKO so now looking at the T56.
I have emailed Mal and he confirms the T56 requires no follow mods to eaither align properly with the tail shaft nor does the hole in the floor require modding to fit the factory console.
Now I have read considerable posts about this not being true but they date back some time. Can anyone confirm today if this is true as my gearbox saga has gone on waaaay too long as it is. 🤦🏽‍♂️
Thanks guys

Edited by LH8VD69, 04 July 2019 - 07:47 PM.


#2 76lxhatch

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Posted 04 July 2019 - 08:14 PM

I can't possibly see how its true if you want to achieve good angles, especially with a lowered Torana. I cut quite a bit out for my TKO; even with HQ engine mounts its about as high as you can get it with the 1330 front yoke without cutting the floor brace to raise the yoke higher, and the angles are borderline, even with a two-piece driveshaft that has a centre CV. You can make things fit without cutting but it won't be ideal.

 

If it helps at all my opinion on the TKO thing is that the idea of people mis-shifting due to expecting an old style H pattern has some merit, and I think that being right hand drive helps this a lot. Obviously there are some actual issues too which have resulted in revisions over the years. I bought mine brand new a few years ago and no problems with third, if anything second is the hardest to get in (for similar reasons, its hardest to push that way). A long stick helps a lot by giving you some leverage without needing to be rough or require as much momentum (so you don't require pinpoint accuracy first time to shift), the Pro 5.0 shifter helps even more.

 

Having said all that either gearbox needs cutting and if I did it all again the T56 would probably be the pick. I managed to sneak my floor mods inside the console, its tight but it works.



#3 ozyozyozy

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Posted 04 July 2019 - 08:36 PM

Definitely tunnel cut for t56 and i did cut for TKO to get a better angle.
If not driving regularly at higher speeds can possibly get away without cutting for TKO.

The tko is great as a performance street, bang for buck, if your trying to push it, you will absolutely have shift issues, they dont like decent rpm or shifting under high load up hill.
Carbon synsros on 2 to 5 do improve a little.
Know a number of people that have used the TKO, all have had issues BUT these cars have been used in anger, not traffic light runs.

The 6 speed is a better shifting box, they can also have some internal issues depending which model, sorry dont know which ones as there have been a few and they have had factory revisions.

#4 LH8VD69

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Posted 04 July 2019 - 11:36 PM

Bloody hell, If it’s a fact I don’t know why MW just doesn’t say that.🤦🏽‍♂️ If I have onmod the tunnel I guess I will just have to. Hopefully I can still use my factory console.
How much higher and how far back did you guys have to go?

#5 76lxhatch

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Posted 05 July 2019 - 05:45 AM

Yeah I don't try to flat shift mine (well, not quite...) since its still a synchro box and I have a rev limit of ~6300rpm. Its a bit heavy to shift (which makes sense, everything inside is heavy) but once you get your technique right it works.

 

There are some photos of floor mods in my build thread:

http://www.gmh-toran...-11#entry901480

Keeping scrolling through to see how it fits with the console.

 

Basically I lifted it as far as I could go without having to cut the floor brace, this is where the slip yoke sits so it needs a little clearance. I suspect the T56 would be similar being a long box also. Its still not quite as high as it was with the Muncie before it (the Muncie is a lot shorter and the yoke/uni was further forward with more room).

 

The T56 has a rounder shape which might be helpful since the Torana tunnel is so narrow, the square shape of the TKO is often cited as good for clearance but that would really only apply in a bigger car and is an issue with the console.



#6 myss427

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Posted 05 July 2019 - 09:13 AM

T56 Magnum in mine, cut the whole floor tunnel out to get the right angles, no vibration issues. Put a TKO 600 in my brothers monaro, same thing, new tunnel etc. Also, he had the bad 3rd gear issues, but was fixed with the Mall Wood shifter, he has changed gear at 7600, with no issues.



#7 axistr

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Posted 05 July 2019 - 10:00 AM

I have a TKO in my hatch and a T56 magnum box in the SLR. Neither floor has been cut, and both cars have the original consoles fitted. The T56 defently fits the tunnel better than the TKO. Both boxes shifters line up with the original shifter hole in the floor. The T56 magnum box need no mods to go straight in unlike a commodore version which will need the extension housing changed to suit.

 

Both gearboxes have electronic and cable speedo drives and I use both on the two cars.(electronic engines and original mechanical speedo) The tail shaft angle is better with the T56 but not perfect. I don't have any noticeable vibrations with the T56, and the only noticeable aspect that the angle isn't perfect is a very slight rumble when I back off on over run. I have taken it up to 160km and have a 3.9-1 rear axle ratio, 17" wheels. No one ever notices it but me, I know its there. I still have the original upper and lower rear control arms so the diff angle has not been adjusted. If I forked out for a set of adjustable top control arms I could possibly make it better. But it just not enough to get worried about. If I had the car lowered more at the rear I would defently need to improve the drive shaft angle.

 

The TKO angle is less than desirable. The hatch is lowered considerably more than the SLR and is still running 14" wheels. I fitted rear upper control arms to improve the angle and although I found a sweet spot on drive I had vibrations and a rumble on over run. I ended up putting in a two piece tail shaft which has eliminated the vibrations and the over run rumble, however the engine has truck loads of torque and around 500hp. With 265x14 rear tyres there is reasonably good grip and in first gear if I bury the throttle hard the centre bearing loads up and I can hear a slight rattle as the rubber bottoms out, this is due to the working angles at the CV joint. Again is not bad enough to get to excited about but its there. The Hatch excites the rear tyres very easily when provoked but I rarely punish it much these days.

 

I have had a few oil leaks with the TKO from new. The top lid needed to be resealed. The front cluster cap leaked, and I have replaced the output seal a couple of times. The rear extension housing bush is perfect so I don't know why they have been a problem.

 

Driving wise the T56 magnum box if far superior. I used to think the TKO shifted reasonably well till I put the T56 in the SLR. The TKO feels like a truck gearbox when compared to the T56. The T56 is also rated at 700hp which is a fair amount more than my TK0500. Both gearboxes were purchased brand new. I purchased the T56 from Summit racing in the states and cost me around $4,500.00 from memory landed to my front door. I think DHL charged me some sort of government tax around $300. 

 

In summery the ratios are much better in the T56, the shift is an absolute dream to change gears, its a better fit in the tunnel and a stronger box. The only down side I can see is the T56 costs a bit more and a few more kg heavier. I haven't had an other problems with the TKO other than the few oil leaks but if it ever shit it self I wouldn't rebuild it and would be happy to put the T56 magnum box it too.



#8 neglectedtorana

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Posted 08 July 2019 - 09:14 PM

Don't know anything about these but could be an option

http://www.vpw.com.a...?Brand=Richmond

#9 myss427

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Posted 09 July 2019 - 10:44 AM

Been around for 20 years or more, first strong 5 speed that was affordable, lots of cutting to get them to fit, shifter on the side and very long like the T56.



#10 LH8VD69

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 07:53 PM

Don't know anything about these but could be an option

http://www.vpw.com.a...?Brand=Richmond


Looks like a strong box but about the same price as the TKO and T56.

I think I’ll end up going the T56. Just checking out the final drive ratio, looks like I’ll be changing my diff.

#11 Bigfella237

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Posted 11 July 2019 - 08:45 PM

 ~ looks like I’ll be changing my diff.

 

Just keep in mind your driveshaft's critical speed if you're going low with the diff ratio, it's easy to forget when you have steep overdrives bringing the engine RPM down.



#12 koalasprint

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Posted 12 July 2019 - 04:14 PM

I installed a TKO into my hatch. No issues with gear selection. Haven't cut the floor. Also using Kingswood engine mount plates to drop the front of the engine. Kept shimming gearbox up until it hit occasionally, then took out 1.5mm of shim. Doesn't hit now. Still had sudden jerking from 40km/h to 60km/h when trying to maintain the same speed. If accelerating or decelerating all was good. Put upper adjustable arms in to correct pinion angle. But also had to move exhaust to under diff as the diff/control arm ears fouled when trying to get the angle right. Sits on these low speeds fairly well now. Big cam not helping but to me it's worth the sacrifice.  :spoton: 

Only thing to note is that while I now have pinion angle correct, the uni joint operating angles are high at 4.5 degrees. 4000 rpm is the recommended maximum for my driveshaft. 3.08 diff so to maximise uni joint life works out to 160 km/h max speed. So that's ok for me. Only been on the track once and I am happy to sacrifice uni joint life.

 

If I had to do again I'd probably cut the floor. But my car was a runner and that would mean pulling seats, console carpet, etc, etc.   



#13 Bigfella237

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Posted 13 July 2019 - 06:02 AM

  ~ 4000 rpm is the recommended maximum for my driveshaft. ~

 

That seems really low, Steve, unless you have a particularly small diameter shaft (no pun intended I swear), are you sure that's not the ½ critical speed figure?

 

Just for the sake of interest...

 

A standard (light green) 4.2L Torana driveshaft should have a critical speed just over 6,500 RPM; and a standard (rust brown) 5.0L driveshaft should have a critical speed of just under 7,200 RPM.

 

So for a Torana with the light green shaft on OEM tyres (say 185/75R13) that equates to a theoretical max road speed of roughly:

268 km/h for a 2.78 diff; or

242 km/h for a 3.08 diff.

 

And for a Torana with the same tyres but with the brown shaft it's roughly:

297 km/h for a 2.78 diff; or

268 km/h for a 3.08 diff.

 

But with an Aussie 4 speed with a 1:1 top gear (that means driveshaft speed also equals engine RPM) both figures are extremely unlikely to ever be reached.



#14 koalasprint

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Posted 13 July 2019 - 09:17 AM

Hi Andrew, the driveshaft speed I came up with is lower because the uni joint operating angle is high at 4.3 to 4.5 degrees. The only way to reduce that is to lift the gearbox and adjust the arms on the diff.

This is where I read about uni-joint angles.

https://shiftsst.com...ine-angles.html



#15 LH8VD69

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Posted 17 August 2019 - 11:46 PM

I’ve ordered the TKO box, MW underdash clutch jobbie and all the accessories.

A question to you guys who have cut the tunnels, did your carpet fit back in ok?

#16 76lxhatch

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Posted 18 August 2019 - 08:00 AM

Mine required cutting as it wouldn't stretch over the higher tunnel nicely but all that is hidden under the console which holds it down at the edges. Added a small piece of dynamat to make up for the lack of sound deadening inside the console area.

 

20181214_180323.jpg



#17 LH8VD69

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 05:34 PM

Hey guys just another question to those who cut their tunnel with the TKO box, what headers have you used for clearance? I’m thinking the fact the box is coming up higher may affect the exhaust too?
Cheers

#18 76lxhatch

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Posted 17 October 2019 - 05:39 AM

Its unlikely to be higher, cutting the tunnel is just to get it close to high enough to maintain the same drivetrain angles. Mine is still a touch lower than it was with the Muncie, didn't want to have to start lifting the whole tunnel (longer box, the driveshaft fouls).

 

Most aftermarket headers hang way too low anyway (especially with HQ engine mounts) and could benefit from adjustment to improve ground clearance. Also don't know how most people get on around the gearbox cross member, I find that I need to have reinforced cutouts either side to tuck the exhaust as high as possible. Factory exhaust went under the tailshaft housing with the smaller/shorter gearbox to achieve the same thing.

 

20150824_111824.jpg

(driver side has primary mods too for steering clearance)

 

20150824_160348.jpg

 

20150824_111904.jpg

 

IMAG0718.jpg

 

This is before modifying the headers (standard Pacemakers with longer 2.5" collectors added), note the gaps above the collectors, way too low:

IMAG0719.jpg






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