Old engine suggestions

Just a (hopefully) quick advice/question.

 

I was planning on putting the new 377 stroker SBC in my HK when I first put it together. However I started to worry about doing that to a new engine when i'll probably be stuffing around for ages setting everything up.

 

So I just bout a nice cheap 283 that was supposedly rebuilt to put in a cruiser (as in a boat), it was put in and run on tap water (heat exchanger) but never went in the water. It is a late 283, has HQ style sump, Flint fuelies (I assume 461), 4BBL alloy intake etc. Looks really clean down on the rockers, but has been sitting in dry storage for a long time (probably over 7 years). It has had a Quadrajet on top of it with secondary air flap closed and primary butterflies closed. Sealed with dizzy, harmonic balancer etc. Exhaust ports are open.

 

Plan is to set the car up with this engine. So:

 

Get the Rodtech front end in.

Get the TH350 sitting correctly and shift linkage, pipes, cooler, tailshaft etc.

Radiator in.

Setup the serpentine drive with air, steer, alternator and electric water pump.

Mount the Holley Sniper and Hyperspark stuff.

Wire everything up.

Get full exhaust made (planning on using Corvette 2.5" Ramshorns).

Get A/C condensor in and all pipes done.

Mount electric fan and connected to Sniper.

 

And then get it running and driving.

 

I was initially planning on whatever I got having a cast iron intake, and then having to fit the Edelbrock Performer air gap Quadrajet intake so the linkages etc all worked., but this one has a pretty high alloy manifold so I might get away with a simple spacer to get the height right.

 

So what would any learned engine people here do to this engine? It turns over fine. I was thinking maybe drop the plugs out and stick a camera down the bores and have a look? Fill it with oil and new filter and drive the oil pump with a battery drill? Then crank it over and compression test? Rocker covers will come off as it has M/T alloy covers that are ugly as so I can have a look there at least. I don't really want to spend too much time or $ on it as it will only be in the car to get it all ready for Engineering. I may even leave it in there if it runs OK for brake tests etc. If Engineer will let me, maybe even pass it and register it to sort the car out with a smaller engine and stock converter, and put the 377 in it later with a decent stall, maybe even get the TH350C built for the new engine's power and put it in at the same time. I realise that the rear main and the converter seals may well leak but I'll know that pretty early on. It is very dry oil wise outside, just very dusty.

Edited by yel327, 12 June 2020 - 03:50 PM.

Ok not learned but cast iron head 101. Would you see which exhaust valves have been open and maybe cold crank compression test these to see if a valve grind is indicated and go from there?

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Yes, I can check those easily. I'll pull the rocker covers off initially and see which ones are open, can look in the exhaust ports too and see how much surface rust is on them too. I'll probably take the intake off and check inside as well, check the cam out at the same time. Hopefully heads don't have to come off but no real biggie if they need to.

I picked up an early low mileage EH 179 from an old mate recently. Had been sitting in his shed 30 years with no manifolds on it in a maritime climate. Pots 1 and 6 were near BDC and had some corrosion on the thrust side of the bores. Steel wool and crc brought them back to just a slight discoloration. Head will get a grind and will probably go in my FB ute. Mate is ex-mechanic and says do hone and rings but don’t think I can be bothered.


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I can't really help either Byron. If the storage was truly dry, I would just stick an air gun into all open holes and then fire it up. 

My old man parked his 149 EH ute out in a paddock when he bought his new HQ in '73. In about 1985 I stuck a battery in it and poured some fuel down the carby, then fired it up and drove it home.

If it’s a cheapie former runner then just crank it and spank it?

 

Does it still have used plugs in it? Do they look ok?

As long as it makes oil pressure on cranking then I wouldn’t go pulling too much apart. Before you know it you have done a reco on a motor you don’t want to keep.

Thanks guys. I just pulled the rocker covers off and it is as clean as a whistle inside. Thermostat housing is very clean and thermostat looks new. I haven't pulled the plugs yet Rexy, will do that when I get a camera that fits down plug holes. 

 

I think I'll still pull the intake off to at least give it a good clean, as you can see it is all cruddy and in need of a tidy up, plus to make sure the water passages are all OK. Intake is a Weiand 8004 which isn't that far in carby height off the Edelbrock Perfromer 2601 I'm using so will be good for setup. This way I can give it a good clean, paint the engine and put it back together with clean bolts. No accessories will be staying except for the harmonic balancer if it is still OK.

 

I have heaps of partial gasket sets here so no drama to pull the heads off too if I have to, a little camera will probably tell the story. If I have pop the valves and give them a tidy up no dramas either. I put the old 350 exhaust manifolds on so I had something to tie it down with ports have been open to the air.

 

These 1964 283 blocks are actually pretty useful things, a SJ 327 crank will bolt straight in to make a 307 or if you want you can bore them to 4" to make a 302 or use the 327 crank and its a 327. You wouldn't built a real high power engine out of it but a Fuellie headed 327 with decent intake and a mild cam will get you 300hp easily. By the engine number I think this is out of an Aussie GMH assembled Impala, it is a Canadian block. Heads are 1967 462 Fuelies. 

 

 283.1.JPG   351.64K   6 downloads

 283.2.JPG   367.68K   5 downloads

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Edited by yel327, 13 June 2020 - 03:42 PM.

See what you mean about the rocker covers


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Or my mates motto change plugs ,oil ,points if need be run for 10 minutes then skid it
boom then you will know

Whats those exhaust manifolds off a steam ship ?

Early 70’s SBC. HQ 350 had one side similar and a Ramshorn on the other side. These were off my old HJ Kingswood ute that ran a 70’s 350/TH400. It got written off about 20 years ago and I kept the driveline. Engine gone elsewhere but I still have all it’s accessories in the shed, these were hanging on the wall and easier to get to than any of the Ramshorns! I still find bits of that ute from time to time when looking for other bits. I saw it’s TH400 and 2.78 LSD last week tucked away at the back of the shed, and it’s original sports dash is still there somewhere. The spare wheel was an original Rally rim and I found it again a while back. All the trim went into my Overlander before I sold it.

Lucky I didn't say Ram's Horn cos you already said it...……………………….Ol' fartz stuff

I’m hoping to use some Corvette 2.5” Ramshorns on this car. I’m over the noise and leaking of extractors. They are available repro, I’d just get them HPC coated. I’m hoping that with the Rodtech front end and front mounted steering rack that I have enough clearance to run these straight pipe Ramshorns and a decent 2.5” pipe bend.

http://performancewa...&product_id=345

Compared to extractors would you lose much power using those Ramshorns ??
Im thinking of using 308 manifolds on my build just not sure

Yeah nah ‘stractors. Tink tink tink. Cook your starter motor and everything else in the engine bay.


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Compared to extractors would you lose much power using those Ramshorns ??
Im thinking of using 308 manifolds on my build just not sure

The standard cast manifolds on SBC’s dropped a lot of power. GM tested the Corvette engines 25hp higher in SAE Gross than the identical engine with the other body style’s cast manifolds. So the 300hp 327 in Corvette is the 275hp in other Chevrolet and Pontiac. Same with the 325hp and 350hp 327. They limited it to 10hp for the LT1 (370hp vs 360hp) but I think the limitations of the Corvette Ramshorns were really starting to show on the LT1. I have seen a guy’s dyno tests too in the USA where he dynoed a 377 (they call them 383) with Corvette style Ramshorns vs the dyno headers and there is still more hp in the extractors but not enough to bother for me. Have a read here, only the first few posts are any good, the rest is a waste of your time. It does show that the difference between the dyno headers and the Corvette Ramshorns is far less than dropping the exhaust down to 2” further down. I’ll be running twin 2.5 all the way through offset 2.5” resonators in the stock GTS327/350 location and a Gibson quad 2.5” chambered muffler back in the stock location with modified stock dual-twin outlets (modified to be 2.5” on the muffler side of the outlets).
BTW you’ll lose significant hp with 308 manifolds compared to well designed extractors, but it is only a 308. Rather than spend money on extractors build it as a stroked engine and run the cast manifolds. It’ll have heaps more go, whether it be 350ci or an offset ground 327-330. Just don’t waste your time with a HX or HZ intake, use a V5H one on blue heads or a KC copy on your red heads.
https://www.chevytal...php?tid/256915/

Edited by yel327, 13 June 2020 - 10:41 PM.

Im building a near stock engine plus stroker kits are 4 times the price of extractors
so a good set of Pacemakers looks like the go

Is the Edelbrock performer a good manifold to use ?

Yes. Or a KC manifold.

Strokers aren’t that dear. A crank ready to go is only $500, not much more than a crank grind these days:
http://vi.raptor.eba...402960000&ver=0

5.7 rods ready to go with new bolts aren’t much either, $400 will buy you a set ready to go, or get some stock ones free and spend $200 prepping them. You’ll spend $400 on 308 rods fitting new bolts and resizing them.

Pistons are no dearer than 308 pistons, for the same quality probably half the cost.

Rings and bearings same. Just a bit more machine work and cost of balance. This is assuming you haven’t already bought new pistons, ground the crank and refurbed the rods.

Mate just bought a stroker kit for a 308 2.5k then 3K machining next thing he is up to 10K with all the bolt on bits
Im doing a budget build strip and rebuild replace only whats needed even then im looking at 5K min

He paid way too much! For a budget build you don’t need to spend big bucks if all you want is a torquey street engine. Starting from scratch the only extra expense is going to be the reliefs in the bore bases during machining and the bit of extra expense in buying that new crank over machine yours. There might be a little more work in balancing too.
I just went through this with the 350 I had for the HK. A brand new 3.75” stroke crank was no dearer than grinding the 50+ year old 350 crank. Rest cost exactly the same. Only difference is a bit of time for me to clearance the block for the rod bolts. I get the luxury of 27ci extra, with a 308 you get 42ci extra for bugger all extra. If it’s mild you use all the same heads, intake etc. My only hesitation would be if you plan to use an Aussie shear pin box.

Factory turbo 400
I will look into it but dont think budget will allow
Just carb and manifold is $1000

No he didnt pay to much
its a Scat stroker kit plus all the other bits like Ice ignition Crane internal kit etc etc etc
machining is expensive over here
they all want to tear you i new one
thats why im not going down that path

I’d do so some sums, remember with new stuff for a street engine there is bugger all machining, just checking. Bore, hone, cam bearings, align hone etc should all be the same for 308 or 350 stroker. If you can cut tiles you should be able to clearance the block yourself, just front and rear bearings with the crank and do one rod/piston at a time. I paid a bit more for Scat rods with no shoulder so the clearancing was stuff all.
I’ve bought most of my expensive stuff when EBay have had 15% off sales and it really does add up.

If machining is dear there you’ll find it makes even more sense to buy a new crank and rods!

Edited by yel327, 14 June 2020 - 02:23 PM.

Manifold $460
Carb $600
Crow engine rebuild kit $1000
Msd dizzy plus coil and leads $450
Extractors $600
Gasket set $100
Powerbond balencer $200
Timing cover $200
Bearings and rings $300
Hone and clearance no cost mates a mechanic
Just under 4K in parts and still need starter motor ,alternator engine mounts ,hoses, etc etc
list goes on

By the time its finished its a 6K build

Price it with that crank in the link I put up. Cost bugger all more. As I said, about the cost of a set of extractors!

Here is another of those ugly exhaust manifolds Gene.

This setup isn’t bad buying either if you had a 6cyl HK-HZ or LH-UC that needs an upgrade.

https://www.gumtree....-350/1250294867