R
Edited by rorym, 28 February 2007 - 10:20 PM.
Biante Series is further away than ever
Started by
_rorym_
, Feb 28 2007 10:17 PM
124 replies to this topic
#1
_rorym_
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 10:17 PM
I have been reading the latest AMC with the new Biante cars being allowed more liberties on new modern components for "servicing and reliabilty" reasons. If EVER there was a time to intoduce a FULL on Series Production type class from 1969/72 to run in conjunction, it is now...dont these guys (CAMS/Biante runners/promoters) get it yet?..They just TOTALLY priced Historic racing out from under the average JOE?..S.Prod would have you and me back into it in a heartbeat..Now they have catered totally for the Paul Stubbers and the rich kids on the block..we are now out to..$2M Historic race setups..or am I the only one here seeing it and on some really weird drugs? No wonder race tracks like Willowbank and the rest are kissing CAMS clarification goodbye at a rate of knots.
R
R
#2
Racehatch
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 10:55 PM
It seems that more and more tracks arnt renewing thier cams licenses, so I guess it not just the competitors who are getting frustrated....
Its dissapointing that all the focus and money seems to be going towards the big show, and not enough is going into the grass roots of motor sport.....
This is just another example of decisions being made for the wrong reasons... I understand that there are is a need to allow freedoms in certain areas to use parts that are more easily available BUT surely there must be a way to keep a lid on it... maybe specifiying certain control parts or something? You end up with a massive void between the big dollar guys and everyone else... how can that be good? Certainly dosnt make it a better from a spectator point of view...
Even in the class that I run in, we run a control tyre and there is a contract between Yokohama and the IPRA to supply this tyre in the sizes agreed on for the term of the contract. Then the other day I find out that the tyre that i use for my car are "no longer being made"... So Yokohama have broken their contract, but instead of opening up the market and letting us find a supplier that can give us the size we need, it has been decided that we have to go from a 225/60/15 to a 225/50/16 - all of a sudden I have to find new rims $1000 - $2500 plus pay an extra $500 on top of what I had to pay for tyres.... mmmm something wrong here...
Its dissapointing that all the focus and money seems to be going towards the big show, and not enough is going into the grass roots of motor sport.....
This is just another example of decisions being made for the wrong reasons... I understand that there are is a need to allow freedoms in certain areas to use parts that are more easily available BUT surely there must be a way to keep a lid on it... maybe specifiying certain control parts or something? You end up with a massive void between the big dollar guys and everyone else... how can that be good? Certainly dosnt make it a better from a spectator point of view...
Even in the class that I run in, we run a control tyre and there is a contract between Yokohama and the IPRA to supply this tyre in the sizes agreed on for the term of the contract. Then the other day I find out that the tyre that i use for my car are "no longer being made"... So Yokohama have broken their contract, but instead of opening up the market and letting us find a supplier that can give us the size we need, it has been decided that we have to go from a 225/60/15 to a 225/50/16 - all of a sudden I have to find new rims $1000 - $2500 plus pay an extra $500 on top of what I had to pay for tyres.... mmmm something wrong here...
#3
dattoman
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 10:57 PM
I see the point of this from the budget racer point of view too
Lets say you had a HG monro trying to put 350 cubes down thru the Muncie box in race conditions.... they don't last long
So maybe there are valid for and against arguements
But I'm with you on a 74-79 replica catagory like Nc .... Nd maybe where we can run our toys without having car history like Nc is.
Lets say you had a HG monro trying to put 350 cubes down thru the Muncie box in race conditions.... they don't last long
So maybe there are valid for and against arguements
But I'm with you on a 74-79 replica catagory like Nc .... Nd maybe where we can run our toys without having car history like Nc is.
#4
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:13 PM
Look it is seriously pissing me off..(Really Doris? Didnt notice?)..We are now looking at a Historic series..and trust me on this..in the near future..that is trying to rival the big catagories for TV airtime..where is the weekend/club racer?..screwed..thats where..In 92 I went to my first Historic meeting at Lakeside..Shit can by far the best day I had at a race meeting for 20 years!!!..free pit access..talk to the boys..etc etc... average run of the mill blokes punting their pride and joy having fun...where are they now?..GONE!..odd hillclimb ,sprint..full stop...they left..because Stubber and crew smoked them..I can tell you of 6 guys in Qld that are out of the game..cant spent the $......Look... Greg/82911 is out as well..I would like to hear his thoughts..for him to stay at the front of the new rules is a $300k investment..or near that..It has stuffed Historic...I would love someone to prove me wrong. Lets have a Series Prod class..I would be in for one. Not at the current rules though.
R
Qld Historic is at Morgan Park this year after Qld raceway dumped its CAMS license...they are struggling for entries..No TV,..No run..No crowd...Big $ have left town.
R
Qld Historic is at Morgan Park this year after Qld raceway dumped its CAMS license...they are struggling for entries..No TV,..No run..No crowd...Big $ have left town.
Edited by rorym, 28 February 2007 - 11:19 PM.
#5
dattoman
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:17 PM
So what can we do ?
#6
_rorym_
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:20 PM
Someone mentioned this AASA or similiar thing..that appears where everyone one is headed...CAMS is on the nose...Big Time!....350LH knows about it..Wakefield Park guys too..
R
R
#7
dattoman
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:23 PM
Well we only have 1 track here and no choice
If we want to race.... we have to go to that track .... no choices
And no-one over here complaining about it yet so nothing will happen on this side of the world
If we want to race.... we have to go to that track .... no choices
And no-one over here complaining about it yet so nothing will happen on this side of the world
#8
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:26 PM
AASA can hire the track on different days..thats what happens here..Lakeside is used by many organisations. Failing that..win Lotto tomorrow and build the track your self.
R
I have a liitle voice from someone saying...(Move to the East, Move to the East!) I wont mention names....
R
I have a liitle voice from someone saying...(Move to the East, Move to the East!) I wont mention names....
Edited by rorym, 28 February 2007 - 11:28 PM.
#9
dattoman
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:29 PM
Theres already a RaceBrakes Sydney and talk of another soon in QLD already
What would I do ?
And where would I go
What would I do ?
And where would I go
#10
_rorym_
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:33 PM
Now for the big questions?
Where are you?
Who are you really?
R
Where are you?
Who are you really?
R
#11
_rorym_
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:41 PM
Gear boxes are free...as long as it is the original 4 'speeds'...a toploader/super T10 is alright for the guys that can buy them..the new rules basically allow 6 spot front brakes etc etc..we are getting too far away...brakes should be original style and type...now we have originality back..you can get shit loads of XW/Y front calipers..same for Torana..Charger etc etc..I still think if this class happens...the yanks are banned...Aussie only Series Prods...I see the point of this from the budget racer point of view too
Lets say you had a HG monro trying to put 350 cubes down thru the Muncie box in race conditions.... they don't last long
So maybe there are valid for and against arguements
But I'm with you on a 74-79 replica catagory like Nc .... Nd maybe where we can run our toys without having car history like Nc is.
R
#12
dattoman
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:45 PM
MeNow for the big questions?
Where are you?
Who are you really?
R
I'm a nobody
At least nobody you will ever have heard of
Located in southern suburbs of Perth WA
Neil Clarke (38) ... see told ya you never heard of me
I'm not a dentist..... despite the pic in forum members exposed thread
Just a humble brake dude
#13
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:49 PM
No pics..Liar! She is right!MeNow for the big questions?
Where are you?
Who are you really?
R
I'm a nobody
At least nobody you will ever have heard of
Located in southern suburbs of Perth WA
Neil Clarke (38) ... see told ya you never heard of me
I'm not a dentist..... despite the pic in forum members exposed thread
Just a humble brake dude
R
#14
dattoman
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:52 PM
plenty of pics of me and car here
http://members.iinet..._1000/index.htm
I have more of me working in the shed preparing the car
But I'm fatter and my trackies kept falling down so I didn't put them on the site
We've gone off topic again ..... we need a banter thread
http://members.iinet..._1000/index.htm
I have more of me working in the shed preparing the car
But I'm fatter and my trackies kept falling down so I didn't put them on the site
We've gone off topic again ..... we need a banter thread
#15
_rorym_
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:52 PM
You do realise that other forum members read our back and forth email exchanges and chose not to comment because they think we are both on some serious bad drugs don't you?
R
R
#16
dattoman
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Posted 28 February 2007 - 11:53 PM
Only drugs I'm on are Progout300
#19
_rorym_
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Posted 01 March 2007 - 12:00 AM
OK!
Back to topic!!
What are we going to do about it Greg?.
Forget W.A.....the rest of us have!!
R
Back to topic!!
What are we going to do about it Greg?.
Forget W.A.....the rest of us have!!
R
#20
dattoman
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Posted 01 March 2007 - 12:03 AM
You scared him off
I'm wearing an open face helmet
So you can sorta see me
If you really must have pics ...... come view my webcam sometime big boy
I'm wearing an open face helmet
So you can sorta see me
If you really must have pics ...... come view my webcam sometime big boy
#21
_82911_
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Posted 01 March 2007 - 12:06 AM
oh man... my head hurts! 
The whole biante series thing is like trying to fix a leak in a submarine with wallpaper.
Some background.........
Due mainly to the absurd freedoms that are allowed in engine modification,the speeds have gotten out of control, way out of control. Like 170MPH at Bathurst out of control. So how do you fix the problem? You give them bigger brakes. Well at least that is the answer that the Biante series advisory panel came up with. Not a lot wrong with it I suppose, just evolution of the rules. The whole series is moving steadily closer to the New Zealand series cars, that are thinly disguised sports sedans.
This is not a situation that is unique to historics either.. It is happening throughout most categories in the sport.
Front running commmodore cup cars are now worth well over $100k, 3 years ago you could have bought 5 really good ones for that much.
Sport sedans......... multi valve engines are now legal, as are the 4wd turbo cars, so how long before someone builds a MEGA GTR Skyline and creams them all?
Brute Utes....$100K to buy a franchise, that's before you even buy a car or any pit equipment!
V8 supertaxi's..... booring lets not go there....
Even "grass roots" 3J club cars aka Improved production cars are being bombed by the great $$, although there is still plenty of people struggling on with a very modest budget and a "home built" car.
So what is the result of all this "win at all cost" superspends by the rich and mostly undertalented drivers/aimers? Well it is forcing the enthusiasts out of the sport, is what it is doing. Look at the number of entries that are fronting at a race meeting in the last year or 2, numbers are waaaay down.
THE ANSWER..... Buggered if I know....And to be honest, buggered if I care anymore.
Let them race for their $3 plastic cup in their $100K, 30 year old car that someone else built for them.
Even if their lap times are slower than those that went before them, using only "home built junk"
Cheers Greg..
The whole biante series thing is like trying to fix a leak in a submarine with wallpaper.
Some background.........
Due mainly to the absurd freedoms that are allowed in engine modification,the speeds have gotten out of control, way out of control. Like 170MPH at Bathurst out of control. So how do you fix the problem? You give them bigger brakes. Well at least that is the answer that the Biante series advisory panel came up with. Not a lot wrong with it I suppose, just evolution of the rules. The whole series is moving steadily closer to the New Zealand series cars, that are thinly disguised sports sedans.
This is not a situation that is unique to historics either.. It is happening throughout most categories in the sport.
Front running commmodore cup cars are now worth well over $100k, 3 years ago you could have bought 5 really good ones for that much.
Sport sedans......... multi valve engines are now legal, as are the 4wd turbo cars, so how long before someone builds a MEGA GTR Skyline and creams them all?
Brute Utes....$100K to buy a franchise, that's before you even buy a car or any pit equipment!
V8 supertaxi's..... booring lets not go there....
Even "grass roots" 3J club cars aka Improved production cars are being bombed by the great $$, although there is still plenty of people struggling on with a very modest budget and a "home built" car.
So what is the result of all this "win at all cost" superspends by the rich and mostly undertalented drivers/aimers? Well it is forcing the enthusiasts out of the sport, is what it is doing. Look at the number of entries that are fronting at a race meeting in the last year or 2, numbers are waaaay down.
THE ANSWER..... Buggered if I know....And to be honest, buggered if I care anymore.
Let them race for their $3 plastic cup in their $100K, 30 year old car that someone else built for them.
Even if their lap times are slower than those that went before them, using only "home built junk"
Cheers Greg..
#22
tinkers
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Posted 01 March 2007 - 12:18 AM
I could always add the photosI have more of me working in the shed preparing the car
But I'm fatter and my trackies kept falling down so I didn't put them on the site
#23
Racehatch
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Posted 01 March 2007 - 12:24 AM
I think for me personally, motor racing is still all "warm and fuzzy" and I still just get a buzz just being out there... Havnt put alot of thought (or pressure) on myself to win at all costs... One of the things I like about this forum (and others) is finding other ppl out there who are somewhere around the same level as me, and are looking to get out on the track and have some fun...
I'm looking for maximum enjoyment from what I do, of course I want to win, but just making small gains and reaching achievable goals gives me great satisfaction as well. What really gets my goat is when the rules are changed to make it harder for me to even get out there..!!
Thats where the REAL problem lies..... well in my eyes anyway.... But when you have ppl with an agenda, lots of money and the power to make decisions on where the sport is heading... it makes you wonder what hope we have...
I'm looking for maximum enjoyment from what I do, of course I want to win, but just making small gains and reaching achievable goals gives me great satisfaction as well. What really gets my goat is when the rules are changed to make it harder for me to even get out there..!!
Thats where the REAL problem lies..... well in my eyes anyway.... But when you have ppl with an agenda, lots of money and the power to make decisions on where the sport is heading... it makes you wonder what hope we have...
#24
_rorym_
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Posted 01 March 2007 - 07:59 AM
Well said Greg, Historic RRCQ has just done a survey with their membership renewal..trying to find out why entries are down in circuit racing and sprints and hillclimbs are over subscribed. Dont have to be a genius to work it out.
R
R
#25
_82911_
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Posted 01 March 2007 - 08:29 AM
Rory, are you saying that I'm NOT a genius?Dont have to be a genius to work it out.
Cheers Greg..
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