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Argoshield

Started by _Viper_ , Dec 07 2010 05:00 PM

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12 replies to this topic

#1 _Viper_

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 05:00 PM

Hey guys, I got a gas mig with Argoshield and I noticed the other day that it has 3% oxygen in it... Now as far as I'm aware the gas is there to displace and shield the weld from oxygen so was just wondering what it's doing in there?

Also I'm buying a TIG soon, can I use Argoshield in both the mig and TIG or do I have to change to 100% argon (but does 100% argon still work with mild steel in the mig)

It's just that I'd like to only need to rent 1 bottle, I don't really use it that often only a hobbyist

Edited by Viper, 07 December 2010 - 05:02 PM.

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#2 dirtbag

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 05:09 PM

As far as I know you have to use argon for TIG, not argoshield. Unfortunately. One of the reasons I don't have a TIG. Yet : )

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#3 _Bomber Watson_

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 05:39 PM

From my very limited experience you can use Argosheild (oxygen containing) on mild steel with a Tig, but you need Argon for everything else.

Same as with a Mig, if your welding ally or staino (with stainless wire) then you need pure argon.

Cheers.

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#4 derrin71

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 08:00 PM

You can use pure argon in a mig welder on mild steel, the main difference is that argoshield is cheaper because argon is an expensive gas to produce. In argoshield it is watered down with nitrogen. If you are going to have a mig and a tig then it would be cheaper in the long run to just have one cylinder of argon. Less ripoff cylinder rental to pay.

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#5 _Bomber Watson_

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 09:34 PM

Pure argo doesnt burn into mild steel as well, you dont get as good a weld as using argosheild....

Again, from my very limited experience.

Cheers.

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#6 TerrA LX

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 10:47 PM

Yeah o2 is present to increase the burn with mild steel, will probably contaminate the tip in tig.

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#7 _Viper_

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Posted 07 December 2010 - 11:02 PM

Just had abit of a look on the BOC website and it says Mig welding mild steel with pure argon gives a instable arc, it needs the very small amount of oxidizing gases to keep a stable arc.

So if ya do need 100% argon for alloy/stainless I might need to bite the bullet and pay to rent a extra bottle :(

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#8 _nzstato_

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Posted 09 December 2010 - 07:43 AM

This has more to do with the physics of welding. Welding under ~160A the welding arc is characterised by small chuncks of welding wirebreaking off and travelling towards the weld pool (this is known as globular transfer). The 'sizzle' you hear when welding is this process. The shielding gas has two functions, to protect the weld from oxygen contamination and guide the weld chunks to the puddle by preventing an ionized sphere of gas from draging the weld away from the centre of the welding arc.

100 % argon results in a very narrow welding transfer channel, it tends to build up upon transfer and results in very thin welds. Conversely 100% CO2 produces quite a wide weld channel and a wide, flat weld pool, because of this, less material is deposited in the center of the weld and the arc can be difficult to control at low volts/amps. A mix of the two (i.e. argosheild lite) produces a weld of medium width and an arc which is easy to control, especially at low amps/volts (hence why it is so popular).

100 % argon is required for welding alloy because this is done at >160A and at these amps the welding wire arcs off continuously to produce 'spray transfer', the narrow weld channel produced by argon is required to control the welding arc and produce a suitable weld.

100% CO2 can be used in welding sheet metal it just requires some practise, generally running at higher gas flow will aid in cooling the weld and good gun/wire feed control is required. Because it also produces a wide weld it also heats over a wider area, care must be taken in determining heat transfer and so you don't warp the panel.

Check this out for more.
Welding gas
Welding gas 2

NZ being the greatest country in the world :buttrock:

we can get owner bottles here and just pay for the gas (within 2 years my bottle would have paid for iself by not having to pay rental). Can also get disposeable bottles for the various mixes for small jobs TM (will try these out one day).

Edited by nzstato, 09 December 2010 - 07:56 AM.

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#9 TerrA LX

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Posted 09 December 2010 - 11:03 AM

Can't you still own your bottles here????

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#10 _nicko61_

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Posted 09 December 2010 - 05:01 PM

Can't you still own your bottles here????

no, one day there might be some competition so the thieving practice of rent the bottle dissapears

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#11 benno81

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Posted 10 December 2010 - 06:58 PM

sam is spot on

yeah u can still own ur own bottle go to repco etc lol but they are only small bottles ive been using them for a while now $20 and it gives u well depends on gas pressure i turn it down a lot so i get about 5 to 6 hrs out of a bottle which is alot of welding

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#12 _nicko61_

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Posted 08 January 2011 - 07:16 AM

sam is spot on

yeah u can still own ur own bottle go to repco etc lol but they are only small bottles ive been using them for a while now $20 and it gives u well depends on gas pressure i turn it down a lot so i get about 5 to 6 hrs out of a bottle which is alot of welding

are you talking about the disposable bottles? ie. little throw away's? or proper bottles from E size and bigger?

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#13 _Liam_

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Posted 08 January 2011 - 10:04 AM

sam is spot on

yeah u can still own ur own bottle go to repco etc lol but they are only small bottles ive been using them for a while now $20 and it gives u well depends on gas pressure i turn it down a lot so i get about 5 to 6 hrs out of a bottle which is alot of welding

That sounds like the go. I would only be using the gas on panels etc, and decent welding, like the chassis, trans tunnel, braces etc use the gasless cos there is no real reason to have fine welds and the the heat warp is not really an issue on the thicker metal.

Thanks for that mate.

nicko61: let us know how you get on if Repco down the bay has any. (I'm in Maryborough and flooded in my own house atm.)