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painting over old paint job.


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#1 hainzy

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 05:16 PM

Hi all.
As discussed on here a while ago I have a mandarin red LX which has been painted dark red. Im doing a backyard paintjob and just planning on sanding back the paint a bit then priming/hi fill etc over the top. All rust has been fixed and is in etch primer.

Where the previous paint is good, is it ok to just sand it back a layer or 2 with 80 grit and/or wire brush, then prime/hi fill over the top? Is it best to go back to the mandarin red layer or is it OK, as a mate has suggested; to just use 80 grit to take the gloss off and make a decent key in the paint and spray over that?

I realise that back to metal is best, and thats happened in a few spots, but overall Im not going for a show job, juist a backyard respray back to the original colour.

Heres some pics to illustrate what im talking about.

Cheers.

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#2 _Quagmire_

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 05:32 PM

i'd go 120/180....tends to feather the edges more
so long as it ain't cracking and your not mixing enemel with acyrlic you'll be fine

#3 _Emu_

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 05:46 PM

Apologies for the hijack....what about 2k over acrylic?

#4 hainzy

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 06:09 PM

i'd go 120/180....tends to feather the edges more
so long as it ain't cracking and your not mixing enemel with acyrlic you'll be fine


Thanks mate. So 80 is a bit too harsh on the edges? Would 120/180 still be a nice enough surface key to paint over?

#5 _Bomber Watson_

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 06:16 PM

120-180 would be fine for the key.

so long as the paints not peeling you can go back over it. If your sanding it and the edge keeps "chipping" away then its no good and needs to come off back to the next layer.

Cheers.

#6 hainzy

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 08:24 PM

120-180 would be fine for the key.

so long as the paints not peeling you can go back over it. If your sanding it and the edge keeps "chipping" away then its no good and needs to come off back to the next layer.

Cheers.


Thanks Bomber. The paint on there seems very good in most places. The shot of the plenum is an area ive gone over quickly with the wire brush but not the sandpaper yet so still looks flakey. Other areas the paints in good nic so thats good to know. I'll keep flakey in mind as my key word. Pardon the pun.... Cheers.

#7 _Quagmire_

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 08:48 PM

Apologies for the hijack....what about 2k over acrylic?

apply a sealer/2k hi fill
and tmk you are good...i've never worked with 2k....chemicals and no booth proper ppe etc

#8 Indy Orange

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 08:51 PM

Apologies for the hijack....what about 2k over acrylic?

My car was painted just over a year ago now ,the painter sprayed 2pac over acrylic but used whats called an "isolator "in hindsight i should have insisted on acrylic as this is what i originally asked for ,but anyhow as i said this was over a year ago now and shows no signs of cracking ,delaminating or whatever ,the paint cost me $5000 all the preparation before painting was done by myself ,so far so good ,if i was doing it again i would have gone acrylic over acrylic or back to bare metal.Maybe if its done right its ok?

Edited by Indy Orange, 10 November 2012 - 08:53 PM.


#9 _Bomber Watson_

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Posted 10 November 2012 - 09:22 PM

My LJ is just a urethane 2k primer over the acrylic.

#10 _LH SLR 3300_

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 08:08 AM

When working with previously painted parts like that where i'm not going back to bare steel, i try to remove as much of the non-factory paint/undercoats as possible & finish off with P180 as Bomber suggested or even P240. Whether using acrylic or 2K, the reason i do this is to avoid sink back. As with most older cars like this, they have been touched up or repainted at some stage & if the original preparation isn't the best, it can lead to problems in your new paint. Example, i bare metalled my orange LH apart from the bonnet & beaver panel where i feathered out all scratches & repairs with P240 then applied three coats of 2K hi-fill primer. All the panels that were bare metalled, the paint has held out fine, however after nearly 12 months, there is sink back on the bonnet & beaver appearing as faint rings such as you see on a geographic map around the feathered edges under the paint. Acrylic is a thermal plastic coating & "moves" around ie expands & contracts with heat, so anything applied over the top will do so too.

#11 _Emu_

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 11:08 AM

When working with previously painted parts like that where i'm not going back to bare steel, i try to remove as much of the non-factory paint/undercoats as possible & finish off with P180 as Bomber suggested or even P240. Whether using acrylic or 2K, the reason i do this is to avoid sink back. As with most older cars like this, they have been touched up or repainted at some stage & if the original preparation isn't the best, it can lead to problems in your new paint. Example, i bare metalled my orange LH apart from the bonnet & beaver panel where i feathered out all scratches & repairs with P240 then applied three coats of 2K hi-fill primer. All the panels that were bare metalled, the paint has held out fine, however after nearly 12 months, there is sink back on the bonnet & beaver appearing as faint rings such as you see on a geographic map around the feathered edges under the paint. Acrylic is a thermal plastic coating & "moves" around ie expands & contracts with heat, so anything applied over the top will do so too.


Great info.
So the isolators don't work as they are supposed to?

#12 Indy Orange

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 11:30 AM

Automotive paint coatings and isolators have come along way since the days of enamel paint ,i had the isolator applied over good condition acrylic and then 2pac ,as i said i haven't had any problems ,it was done by a spray painter panelbeater .Good preparation is the key. But if i had this done again i would go bare metal i think.

#13 _LH SLR 3300_

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 12:59 PM

isolaters can & do work, but as mentioned above, preparation is paramount & the problem with cars that have had previous work done, you do know if that preparation was up to scratch & sometimes you only find out when fresh solvents are applied in the course of a fresh re-paint & problems such as fry ups & sink back occur. Recently i did an engine bay resto on an LH that had been resprayed several times in the past. The owner didn't want to completely strip the paint, so i sanded & prepped the original paint finish as best i could. We applied an isolater followed by 2K hi-fill, but by the time we were ready to rub the hi-fill, large areas were starting to crack & peel & we could peel off by hand numerous layers of paint off right back to the first respray. The solvents in the isolater & hi-fill reacted with the old paint causing delamination & we had no choice but to take the whole engine bay back to steel.

#14 _pocock_

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Posted 11 November 2012 - 10:32 PM

yes i would strip all the old paint off for peace of mind,, had a similar problem myself with old paint after painting over it problems surfaced and had to strip and repaint i should of done it right in the first place




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