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Carburettor 465 holley v 500 Barry Grant question 202 red

Started by _torrybogan_ , Oct 13 2014 12:51 PM

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24 replies to this topic

#1 _torrybogan_

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Posted 13 October 2014 - 12:51 PM

Hi guys its time to bite the bullet and throw the triple su carbs to the scrap heap I have had enough of the constant ongoing problems with them that has resulted in the car being garaged constantly undriveable and I don't have the 100's of spare hours to get them to run properly only for them to drop out of tune the next day..My engine is fairly worked so I am looking at a 465 4 barrel holley or the 2 barrel Barry Grant 500 I was wondering if there is much difference between the 2 carbs and any input you guys may have had running these carbs ?? Thanks

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#2 _judgelj_

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Posted 13 October 2014 - 01:05 PM

Sorry, but if your SU's are that much of a hassle, they are rooted. It's like trying to fill a bucket with holes in it. My SU's have not given me a single bit of trouble, but then again i paid $1400 for their rebuild. There is no such thing as 100's of man hours with them, they are simple as piss and took a whole 30mins to have tuned.

You have two options, fix them an run them, or go with a different carb like you have mentioned. Just dont write them off for the wrong reasons.

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#3 _oldjohnno_

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Posted 13 October 2014 - 07:43 PM

Sorry, but if your SU's are that much of a hassle, they are rooted. It's like trying to fill a bucket with holes in it. My SU's have not given me a single bit of trouble, but then again i paid $1400 for their rebuild. There is no such thing as 100's of man hours with them, they are simple as piss and took a whole 30mins to have tuned.

You have two options, fix them an run them, or go with a different carb like you have mentioned. Just dont write them off for the wrong reasons.

:iagree:

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#4 micklx

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Posted 13 October 2014 - 09:48 PM

I once had a 350 Holley on a fairly hot 186. I swapped to a 465 and found it was better for driveability and outright power.

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#5 _SLEDGE_

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Posted 13 October 2014 - 09:49 PM

Sorry, but if your SU's are that much of a hassle, they are rooted. It's like trying to fill a bucket with holes in it. My SU's have not given me a single bit of trouble, but then again i paid $1400 for their rebuild. There is no such thing as 100's of man hours with them, they are simple as piss and took a whole 30mins to have tuned.

You have two options, fix them an run them, or go with a different carb like you have mentioned. Just dont write them off for the wrong reasons.

Here here.

I had my 1-3/4 set of SUs on a hot 186 for more than 2 years (daily driver) without ever touching them... However before they were fitted, I'd meticulously rebuilt them, fitted new linkages and got some serious help setting them up from a knowledgeable mate experienced with tuning these carbs on Holden and Jaguar inline 6's. I didn't have half a hope doing it all myself.

They never gave me any sort of headaches, and always performed beautifully. They are a very simple carb but everything has to be right.

You should give them a 2nd (or 3rd or 4th) chance... maybe chuck on a single holley like you suggested so you can drive the thing while your su's are rebuilt? After all there's nothing like an LJ 2 door with triple carbs, they are meant to have them :spoton:

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#6 warrenm

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 05:29 AM

:iagree: with oldjohnno & judgelj don't take them off for the wrong reason.

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#7 _judgelj_

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 11:01 AM

And look, it may be the case that you dont want to spend cash on them, which is fine. Go for a single carb, just dont perpetuate the ignorance surrounding them.

They are not even hard to tune, you just need the right tools. For a while, I felt like i couldnt do it, and to some extent i still do. But when you think about it, all you are doing is setting idle an mixture. The only catch is you have to do the same for all 3. Takes less than 30 mins, maybe a bit of on going R+D with the mixtures, but so what?

And Jack, i couldnt agree more. After falling in love with them, I would never run a single carb on a holden 6 unless it had a 'hair-dryer' hanging off it! Just looks so wrong...

Edited by judgelj, 14 October 2014 - 11:04 AM.

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#8 _torrybogan_

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 03:41 PM

Rebuilding them is an option for the 5th time , but I would prefer something that started with no hassles , would you have to re-jet a 500 cfm barry grant to suit mild to hot 6 ?

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#9 _Agent 34_

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 05:20 PM

Rebuilding them is an option for the 5th time , but I would prefer something that started with no hassles , would you have to re-jet a 500 cfm barry grant to suit mild to hot 6 ?

If cold - lift bonnet and on one of the carbies - wire up the choke linkage and engage the choke - spray with " START YA BASTARD " re enter the car and crank.

THE BASTARD WILL START .

warm up and then " UN WIRE THE CHOKE LINKAGE " .

Ps - if they are doing it when warm then there is another problem. have CD's ( road car) and SU's on the (race car ) and i really like the SU. action.

little tip.

but are a bastard unless they are warmed up and have fuel to the bowl and this may be an issue for you if the car has been sitting for awhile.

g

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#10 EunUCh

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 05:35 PM

They sure do need that "cold start" device,there is not much too them providing the shafts are not worn out too bad/float set etc. and that they are

synchronized....the cold start (choke) side of things can be a bit to get right but not that hard with a couple of practice runs to learn

how they respond under different temps.

Fuel pressure can be another issue...particularly if it is on the high side.

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#11 _judgelj_

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Posted 14 October 2014 - 08:12 PM

How have they been rebuilt 4 times? There is more to a rebuild than replacing the consumables. The linkage shafts need to be replaced and linkage bores re bushed so they dont leak. Like i said, mine cost $1200 just for the rebuild, not including the extra $$ for hydro blasting. Starts first time every time (even when cold), unless sitting idle for months, then they need the choke. The only reason it's hard is because they don't squirt fuel, but at least you can't flood them.

Dont wire and unwire a choke, just pull the jet down on the middle carb and fit a clothes peg.

Edited by judgelj, 14 October 2014 - 08:13 PM.

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#12 _Agent 34_

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 05:43 AM

Dont wire and unwire a choke, just pull the jet down on the middle carb and fit a clothes peg.

cheers - learn something every day

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#13 _oldjohnno_

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 07:09 PM

Here's an idea - why not just connect up a choke cable so you can start it from the comfort of the drivers seat?

If they've been rebuilt already and still don't work it's almost certain that the rebuilder is severely retarded. Try to find someone who can dress themselves in the morning to do it next time.

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#14 _judgelj_

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 07:18 PM

Because clothes pegs come in a variety of colours?

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#15 _oldjohnno_

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 07:32 PM

Because clothes pegs come in a variety of colours?

Kids today and their fancy coloured clothes pegs. Nothing but plain wooden pegs will ever go on my SUs.

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#16 _judgelj_

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 08:14 PM

Haha very well said!

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#17 mick_in_oz

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 08:15 PM

Do what oldjohnno said about the choke cable!

As for the worn throttle shaft, rather than rebushing, there are over-sized shafts available, all you need to do is ream the body to suit the new shaft, lots cheaper and quicker.

A Holden 6 should have triples!

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#18 warrenm

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Posted 15 October 2014 - 11:38 PM

Do what oldjohnno said about the choke cable!

As for the worn throttle shaft, rather than rebushing, there are over-sized shafts available, all you need to do is ream the body to suit the new shaft, lots cheaper and quicker.

A Holden 6 should have triples!

Couldn't have said it better myself.

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#19 caterham2

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Posted 16 October 2014 - 01:09 PM

Hi guys its time to bite the bullet and throw the triple su carbs to the scrap heap I have had enough of the constant ongoing problems with them that has resulted in the car being garaged constantly undriveable and I don't have the 100's of spare hours to get them to run properly only for them to drop out of tune the next day..My engine is fairly worked so I am looking at a 465 4 barrel holley or the 2 barrel Barry Grant 500 I was wondering if there is much difference between the 2 carbs and any input you guys may have had running these carbs ?? Thanks

I have 3 x 2" SU on my XU1, been on for "years" adjusted the idle speed ONCE in all that time. Yours MUST BE KNACKERED.

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#20 _torrybogan_

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Posted 18 October 2014 - 04:44 PM

Yea the triples keep fouling my plugs up and its a pain getting stuck on the side of the road everytime I drive it with fouled plugs running on 4 cylinders,

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#21 Dave6179

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Posted 19 October 2014 - 09:10 AM

Running too rich, wrong needles, plugs too cold. Buy a ColourTune and set them properly. I use TW needles, have since 1992 when I fitted the SUs. Still use them today! Been reshafted twice.

Edited by Dave6179, 19 October 2014 - 09:11 AM.

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#22 warrenm

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Posted 19 October 2014 - 10:00 PM

I think you have a "tune" problem not a carb problem. As has already been pointed out previously(Dave6179), get the correct needles & it will not foul plugs.

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#23 _duggan208_

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Posted 01 December 2014 - 12:43 AM

You will never get a single carb to out perform or even match your SU's. I would think that would be due to the unequal manifold design of a single carb. I know sweet FA about SU's, I've got multi throttle body EFI and they have been a absolute pain in the arse, I've wanted to smash the bastard things with any hammer close by. But with expert advise and plenty of help I'm getting them sorted out. Blokes have been setting SU's up on Holden 6's sinse goodness knows when. Just need the right advice on set up and there is plenty of it here. Stick it out and hang on to them.

Regards