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ticking/rattling 253

Started by _oikurtman_ , Sep 06 2006 10:45 PM

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#1 _oikurtman_

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Posted 06 September 2006 - 10:45 PM

After too much of my own brain strain, i had my mechanic take a look at the ticking/rattling coming from the LH. He said something along the lines of either tappets, lifters, cam or valve guides.

He said not to worry to much about it and try running something like 30W-50 oil to try quieten it, but i don't think I can stand it much longer.

i'm guessing the cheapest and easiest option to start with is the tappets? how should i go about this? what's involved?

i'm hoping i won't have to replace the heads, cam and lifters just to sort this problem, otherwise, I'm thinking I might as well rebuild the whole thing while I'm at it... :<_<:

Cheers.

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#2 rodomo

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Posted 06 September 2006 - 11:07 PM

Cam and lifters (common)especially if it comes and goes.

Edited by rodomo, 06 September 2006 - 11:08 PM.

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#3 TerrA LX

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Posted 06 September 2006 - 11:40 PM

id go with new rockers and fulcrums first.
then if not satisfied go with new lifters and a new mild cam.

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#4 _LX8VD69_

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Posted 06 September 2006 - 11:42 PM

i reckon its your cam

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#5 _oikurtman_

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Posted 07 September 2006 - 10:54 AM

the ticking is there always at idle and always turns to rattle when revving, under load especially.

Cam guy quoted me $440 for a stage 1 cam, new lifters and a new double row timing set. He said most likely will cure problem and will make a huge difference in performance.

Head guy quoted me $660 for a pair of reco heads. (same as 308 heads aren't they?)

Should I do both or just try cam and lifters first? (Good prices?)

My dilemma is, while the intake manifold is off, i feel i should do the heads, and if the heads are off, i might as well spend the extra $500 on a rebuild kit and do the bottom end too. :<_<:

I suppose the only things stopping me are money and the fact that I'd have to pull the engine out again...

Cheers.

Edited by oikurtman, 07 September 2006 - 10:55 AM.

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#6 _[BOTTLEDUP]_

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Posted 07 September 2006 - 06:43 PM

I'd run with a Crow 5602, new lifters and a Crow timing chain, they'd cost you $380. I'd start with the cam and lifters IF the rocker gear isn't worn.

If you are getting the heads reco'd then pay an extra $100 and get some decent valve springs fitted as well, say a set of Crow 4830s, which will let you run a slightly larger cam (5666)

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#7 MRLXSS

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Posted 07 September 2006 - 06:52 PM

i used a Crow 5602 cam in my old 253 and it worked well....

Before u do all this, Whats ur oil pressure like? i had noisy tappets on my old engine cos the oil pressure wasnt up to scratch! do u have a gauge or a dash light?

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#8 _oikurtman_

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Posted 07 September 2006 - 07:02 PM

guage. reads next to nothing at idle and pretty much vertical when driving.

the motor has done around 400,000 kms.

its a lot of money (for me, student) and a lot of time and effort.. i have my doubts.

cheers.

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#9 rodomo

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Posted 08 September 2006 - 07:45 AM

the ticking is there always at idle and always turns to rattle when revving, under load especially.

This type of noise could be exhuast manifold gaskets, flange gasket, cracked exhaust manifold or even head gasket if it still has steel shim head gaskets. Get a mate to hold a rag blocking the exhaust and listen for the noise to get louder at idle.
Good Luck!

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#10 GML-31

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Posted 08 September 2006 - 08:13 AM

I would have thought it would be easier and cheaper to change the motor... surely some one here has a 253 that is pretty good they dont want.

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#11 _[BOTTLEDUP]_

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Posted 08 September 2006 - 12:43 PM

the motor has done around 400,000 kms.

I'd not spend a cent on it if that is an accurate km reading.

Start saving for a rebuild or a good second hand engine.

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#12 makka

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Posted 08 September 2006 - 01:59 PM

,Sep 8 2006, 12:43 PM]
the motor has done around 400,000 kms.
I'd not spend a cent on it if that is an accurate km reading.

Start saving for a rebuild or a good second hand engine.

Im with him, if its 400,000k its not worth sticking a new cam and lifters into, unless you do a full rebuild, or you could spend $200 on a decent 253

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#13 rodomo

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Posted 08 September 2006 - 11:49 PM

Missed the bit about 400k's
Its a boat anchor :tease:

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#14 TerrA LX

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Posted 08 September 2006 - 11:57 PM

Yeah 400 000 km is a good innings, time for a freshen up.

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#15 _Keithy's_UC_

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Posted 09 September 2006 - 06:47 PM

Rebuild her mate! If you lived in or near Townsville i'd do a straight swap with you - my rebuilt 253 for your old one (i'm going to rebuild it again as i want performance parts underneath it - i didnt rebuild it, i got it like that)...

Ahh well...

Goodluck mate!
Keith

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#16 MRLXSS

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Posted 09 September 2006 - 06:51 PM

yeah time to rebuild it! Almost Zero pressure at idle isnt good.

You sought of need about 10psi for every 1000rpm, so at idle it should be about 8psi....

My 290 sits at about 10-20psi at idle.

But you could even find an 253 on ebay or the trado for next to nothing that would have done under 100,000kays and would run like a dream!

Good luck!

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#17 _oikurtman_

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 01:29 PM

yeah i was pretty sure that's what a lot of you would say... that's an accurate 400,000.

i've done the ring around. looks like i'll be up for nearly $2000 to rebuild the 253. (doing it myself)

That's stage 1 cam, timing set, lifters, reco heads, pistons, rings, gaskets, seals, bearings and getting the carby rebuilt. Is it worth it?

Most internal work i've ever done to an engine itself is inlet manifold gaskets... I don't want to spend all that money and stuff it up!

drama, drama... :<_<:

Cheers.

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#18 Tiny

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 02:34 PM

Ask the engine guys you spoke to how much they would charge to assemble it too... Sometimes it's another $500 but its worth the money!

Assembly isnt TOO difficult if youve got the tools and a little bit of knowledge.. and some mates to help out who've hopefully done it before

You can definitely stuff it up assembling it yourself, but as i said above if you get some advise, a good manual, and the right tools then you should be ok!

Might it be worthwhile looking for an already rebuilt 253 or even 308 for the same kind of money?

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#19 _Keithy's_UC_

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 07:18 PM

Yeah i agree with Tiny in a way. But i still think you should give it a go yourself. I built my 179 from scratch and it's runnin like a dream. This is the first motor i had ever built too... Every part you get tells you what to do (i.e - my piston rings had directions on them... Place them at 180 degrees to each other, yadda yadda)... It's pretty easy. Just make sure you get some engine rebuild lube and lube EVERYTHING up as you put it in otherwise you'll throw a bottom end bearing.... And listen to everything your engineer says when he hands the freshly bored block back to you as these guys have been there and back a few times!! They DO know everything there is to know!

I say GO FOR IT!!

Keith

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#20 _oikurtman_

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 07:56 PM

i was hoping i wouldn't have to get the block bored... bad idea? :blink:

engine assembly guys tiny? i spoke to seperate blokes for cam, heads, carby and Repco for the rebuild kit. Know anyone worth a try in Sydney?

I'd like to try it myself, I have a manual, spanners, sockets and a torque wrench. But yeah, lot of money, lot of time, lot of risk.

Cheers. :<_<:

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#21 Tiny

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 08:06 PM

To get it professionally assembled, You'd need to speak to an engine reconditioning shop... I cant reccomend anyone off the top of my head that works on "stockers" ( Sorry!).

But having read what you've said it looks like youve got the tools to do it, and enough knowledge to give it a go!

You'll DEFINITELY need to get the block bored.. there's no doubt about that. You'd be best off taking the engine in pieces to a workshop and getting the engine builder to do all the measuring, machining and even order the parts for you. Then you can take it back, and do the assembly yourself!

You'll need at the VERY LEAST things done like:
Bore and hone block
Possibly deck block so its flat and square
Deck heads so theyre flat and square.

These things need to be done by professional engine builders/machinists.

All in all there's alot of work in it, but honestly.. there's n othing more satisfying that kicking it over for the first time and being able to say " I did that!"

Good luck which ever way you go!

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#22 _LHoon_

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 09:02 PM

Building or rebuilding a motor is both rewarding and gives you peace of mind that you have a quality motor at the end of it. But it does tend to blow the budget a bit, especially on a student's wages.

In my opinion, I think you'd be better off buy an honest second hand motor, either 253 or even 308 which is a good runner. It would only cost around $300-500 for a good motor, which you can drop straight in and it would be good for years.

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#23 _oikurtman_

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 10:06 PM

won't a 308 chew heaps more fuel tho?

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#24 _oikurtman_

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 10:07 PM

won't a 308 chew heaps more fuel tho?

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#25 _Chamois hatch_

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Posted 11 September 2006 - 10:23 PM

yeah buy a second hand motor, and save youself the hassels. and if its correctly tune a 308 shouldnt chew more fuel than a 253. it depends on the carby tho......

cheers