Sorry Grant, I thought the idiot light temp switches you were referring to were usually placed in the cylinder head on most cars and switches in radiators were used to control electric fans, thought it puzzling as i couldnt see any car being provided with an idiot light that would come on at <100C.
Not a fan of switches in the radiator, Ive got whats probably known as the Chev rad in my car with the switch screwed into the top tank. It stopped working about 12 years ago, now it just leaks out the end of it. Im not going to replace it with another one of the same design that will probably not last either. I dont think its a good place to have the switch either, it relies on a good level of water in the top tank(if youve got a leak which drops the water level below it, the fans wont turn on. Think they are much better off in the bottom of the tank, not that im sure you can fit them down there, though the switch needs to be of a lower temp on the other side of the rad, it also eliminates the needless switching on of the fans after short stops where heat soak finds its into the top tank of the rad.
Thermo fans
Started by
knoath
, Feb 08 2006 11:02 AM
79 replies to this topic
#27
_draglc_
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Posted 03 March 2006 - 12:32 PM
A very easy way to mount them is to use a sort of cable tie setup, but today i picked up these cable ties that have a circle on one end, u put the thing through the rad and another circle goes on the other end, pull it tight, cut the end off and hey presto, you dont have to wrap a cable tie around your rad fins.
I got them from N&M spares at northgate, the packet is labelled Auto Transmission Cooler Mounting Kit, made by TRIDON. $9.70 per kit(4 of them). Going to make mounting my 2 10" thermos very easy. Part no is HK210.
A lot easier than making up brackets.
A1
I got them from N&M spares at northgate, the packet is labelled Auto Transmission Cooler Mounting Kit, made by TRIDON. $9.70 per kit(4 of them). Going to make mounting my 2 10" thermos very easy. Part no is HK210.
A lot easier than making up brackets.
A1
#28
View GaragePosted 04 March 2006 - 03:47 PM
Hi everyone
iv got two 10in thermos fans and a reco 4 core HQ radiator.
Now will the two 10in thermos keep my 355 cool or should i get two 12in??
danny....
iv got two 10in thermos fans and a reco 4 core HQ radiator.
Now will the two 10in thermos keep my 355 cool or should i get two 12in??
danny....
#29
_Keithy's_UC_
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Posted 05 March 2006 - 10:42 AM
Just a little 'update' for ya's.....
I fitted my Twin 10" thermo fans yesterday to my UC and they work fine! The fans come with everything required to mount (provided they both fit over your radiator - in my case they were an exact fit to my radiator).
I tested them at every stage of fitting, then fitted a toggle switch from which i can turn them on and off how i please! That is how i wanted to do it btw!
I will upload photos directly of my setup - easy to do!!
Keith
I fitted my Twin 10" thermo fans yesterday to my UC and they work fine! The fans come with everything required to mount (provided they both fit over your radiator - in my case they were an exact fit to my radiator).
I tested them at every stage of fitting, then fitted a toggle switch from which i can turn them on and off how i please! That is how i wanted to do it btw!
I will upload photos directly of my setup - easy to do!!
Keith
#30
enderwigginau
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Posted 05 March 2006 - 11:33 AM
The A9X switch is mounted in a bung in the tp tank btw.
Grant..
Grant..
#31
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Posted 05 March 2006 - 01:45 PM
This is a six with a 4row radiator?Hi everyone
iv got two 10in thermos fans and a reco 4 core HQ radiator.
Now will the two 10in thermos keep my 355 cool or should i get two 12in??
danny....
#33
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Posted 05 March 2006 - 04:12 PM
Sorry, didnt see the 355........how much cooling that would need be would be a guestimate. Id be doubtful that 2x10in fans would do the job. Even though you have a 4 core rad, it wont do anything either without good airflow. Would either go twin ford au/EL/BA electric fans or engine clutch fan with shroud as it could need the works!
B4 you commit, take the car for a drive without any fans on a warm day?
If the engine will stay under thermostat temp at ambients of 35C+ at >80kmh then you should be fine with electric fans, if not engine fan would be more suitable.
B4 you commit, take the car for a drive without any fans on a warm day?
If the engine will stay under thermostat temp at ambients of 35C+ at >80kmh then you should be fine with electric fans, if not engine fan would be more suitable.
Edited by devilsadvocate, 05 March 2006 - 04:25 PM.
#34
_Yella SLuR_
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Posted 06 March 2006 - 02:19 PM
Craig Davis recommendation is 2 x 12" for a 308 if that helps. Check their website, they are bound to have 355 recommendations, however the 2 x 12" just fit on the Torana radiator, although you still have to remove radiator to get two of the clips on.
Also, just rewired my relay from constant power to the ignition circuit. I strongly recommend this. Having fans running with heat soak and no water flowing only seems to kill the battery, and also blows hot air off the extractors onto the solenoid making it cranky as well. Had no problems all weekend with battery after making this change.
It is much easier to wire to constant power though, but don't be tempted.
Also, just rewired my relay from constant power to the ignition circuit. I strongly recommend this. Having fans running with heat soak and no water flowing only seems to kill the battery, and also blows hot air off the extractors onto the solenoid making it cranky as well. Had no problems all weekend with battery after making this change.
It is much easier to wire to constant power though, but don't be tempted.
Edited by Yella SLuR, 06 March 2006 - 02:19 PM.
#35
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Posted 06 March 2006 - 03:11 PM
Yella, did you get to the bottom of your possible "vaporisation"/"cutting out problem?
#36
_Yella SLuR_
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Posted 06 March 2006 - 03:32 PM
Not yet mate. Have the new water pump sitting there. I want to give that a go as well as flushing the radiator before adjusting the timing. The way Bruce does the timing (maximum possible advance to allow hot starts) I think is partly to blame. If all else fails, I'll turn the timing back a fraction more, think it's something ridiculous ATM like 26 deg (off the guage anyways). Think it's just a matter of finding that happy medium, i.e. drop some neddies so I can gain full use of the rev range in all weather conditions.
If that fails, I'll ring Struggler and we'll hit the dyno together. Unfortunately I'm still not supposed to be playing cars ATM (Still on Castle Duties), so just tinkering whenever I get a few spare moments. Poor old car is a bit neglected at the moment.
I hate nothing more than a misbehaving car, like to get em as reliable and bullet proof as I can.
If that fails, I'll ring Struggler and we'll hit the dyno together. Unfortunately I'm still not supposed to be playing cars ATM (Still on Castle Duties), so just tinkering whenever I get a few spare moments. Poor old car is a bit neglected at the moment.
I hate nothing more than a misbehaving car, like to get em as reliable and bullet proof as I can.
#37
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 12:05 AM
Hey guys, time to post up the two thermo's... Just so you know what two 10' fans look like in front of a 6cyl radiator...
#38
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 03:51 AM
A very revealing pic Keith............are they held in position with blue tack?
Interesting you decided to fit them on the outside?
Many will tell you they are more efficient as pullers rather than pushers.....yet not convinced myself.......it appears to be a bit of heresay that has become fact........never seen one bit of evidence to support it...........more inclined to believe it depends on whether the fan has been designed for pushing or pulling in terms of rpm/blade pitch........the same fan cant work equally well from both sides.
Anyway, at least you can run your engine fan(or refit it quickly) if they dont do the job well enough and should last a lot longer being on the front as they will run at ambient temp rather than the temp it comes out behind the radiator, 85C+ when the fans are working. Ive had the bearings cark it on three occasions in Dcraig fans(early 12in design) that have been mounted behind rad, the last one I didnt get to quickly enough and totally seized and burnt out the windings.....................
Hope they go well for you.........when are you going to get rid of the sunbudgie grille?
Interesting you decided to fit them on the outside?
Many will tell you they are more efficient as pullers rather than pushers.....yet not convinced myself.......it appears to be a bit of heresay that has become fact........never seen one bit of evidence to support it...........more inclined to believe it depends on whether the fan has been designed for pushing or pulling in terms of rpm/blade pitch........the same fan cant work equally well from both sides.
Anyway, at least you can run your engine fan(or refit it quickly) if they dont do the job well enough and should last a lot longer being on the front as they will run at ambient temp rather than the temp it comes out behind the radiator, 85C+ when the fans are working. Ive had the bearings cark it on three occasions in Dcraig fans(early 12in design) that have been mounted behind rad, the last one I didnt get to quickly enough and totally seized and burnt out the windings.....................
Hope they go well for you.........when are you going to get rid of the sunbudgie grille?
#39
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 05:03 PM
They are bolted on, i can show you what it looks like from behind the radiator if you would like!
Davies Craig states that these fans are more efficient if placed outside the engine bay, and have therefore set the fans up to be used on the outside rather than the inside...
The temp of my motor sitting at traffic lights or driving never gets over 85 degrees (i dont run them until lower speeds or when i am about to stop at lights). With the belt driven fan, i saw temps over 100degrees celcius.
My grille is off a UC Torana (UC's came out with the same grille no matter what the badge, some chrome, some silver and black).
NOTE: Bolts have since been cut and sprayed black to match radiator, thermo fan wiring has been covered with insulation ducting and re-routed.
Keith
Davies Craig states that these fans are more efficient if placed outside the engine bay, and have therefore set the fans up to be used on the outside rather than the inside...
The temp of my motor sitting at traffic lights or driving never gets over 85 degrees (i dont run them until lower speeds or when i am about to stop at lights). With the belt driven fan, i saw temps over 100degrees celcius.
My grille is off a UC Torana (UC's came out with the same grille no matter what the badge, some chrome, some silver and black).
NOTE: Bolts have since been cut and sprayed black to match radiator, thermo fan wiring has been covered with insulation ducting and re-routed.
Keith
#40
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Posted 07 March 2006 - 10:17 PM
Thanks for the feedback on the fan placement, seems like those must have been designed with cold air in mind. Good to hear the work appears to be a success. Did you squeeze those bolts through the fins?
Re the grille, satin grille was a sunbird feature, Torana SL's got the chrome grille-not sure about Torana S, possibly many toranas running around with the satin number(from small collisions) as I believe all replacement grilles were satin.
Re the grille, satin grille was a sunbird feature, Torana SL's got the chrome grille-not sure about Torana S, possibly many toranas running around with the satin number(from small collisions) as I believe all replacement grilles were satin.
#41
antelopeslr5000
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 05:16 AM
I can't say that I'm a big fan (no pun intended!) of the mounting bolts through the radiator. From what I seen in the past the bolts tend to rub on the radiator tubes, due to vibration, and will eventually cause leaks.
#42
Dr Terry
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 09:06 AM
Hi Guys.
Keith said
"Davies Craig states that these fans are more efficient if placed outside the engine bay, and have therefore set the fans up to be used on the outside rather than the inside..."
I think the above advice is is intended to extend the life of the fan motors against engine heat, rather than them being more 'efficient'.
It's funny that nearly all car manufacturers place there electric fan behind the radiator as 'pullers'.
Dr Terry.
Keith said
"Davies Craig states that these fans are more efficient if placed outside the engine bay, and have therefore set the fans up to be used on the outside rather than the inside..."
I think the above advice is is intended to extend the life of the fan motors against engine heat, rather than them being more 'efficient'.
It's funny that nearly all car manufacturers place there electric fan behind the radiator as 'pullers'.
Dr Terry.
#43
_Yella SLuR_
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 10:56 AM
Think that's the case there FastEH. Could also be a liability issue, fan's less likely to fall off mounted on the front due to poor fitting than the rear.
I used the plastic radiator clips hoping they won't be as severe on the tubes as steel bolts, but probably will. Longer term I want to make up a steel frame to sit behind the radiator to take the fans, so no radiator penetrations.
I used the plastic radiator clips hoping they won't be as severe on the tubes as steel bolts, but probably will. Longer term I want to make up a steel frame to sit behind the radiator to take the fans, so no radiator penetrations.
Edited by Yella SLuR, 08 March 2006 - 10:59 AM.
#44
_Herne_
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 11:11 AM
Alloy would be lighter Yella 
and who knows you may have fun polishing it lol.
Cheers
Herne
and who knows you may have fun polishing it lol.Cheers
Herne
#45
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 11:12 AM
I suspect that too Dr Terry, as ive had to replace bearings numerous times in DC fans that have been mounted on engine side.
What DC claim and what is reality can be a little skewed as you suspect.
On a warm 30+ day, temps exiting the radiator will be 90C+ when the fans are being used. On average,about a 60C difference, this will create a corresponding density change in the air, it will be ~20% less dense on the engine side(the same fan would spin faster on the engine side). So from that variable alone(Im sure its all much more complicated than just this-enter aerodynamic factors ), the fan(pitch and rpm of motor) would have to be designed differently for optimum performance in different air temps.
What DC claim and what is reality can be a little skewed as you suspect.
On a warm 30+ day, temps exiting the radiator will be 90C+ when the fans are being used. On average,about a 60C difference, this will create a corresponding density change in the air, it will be ~20% less dense on the engine side(the same fan would spin faster on the engine side). So from that variable alone(Im sure its all much more complicated than just this-enter aerodynamic factors ), the fan(pitch and rpm of motor) would have to be designed differently for optimum performance in different air temps.
Edited by devilsadvocate, 08 March 2006 - 11:16 AM.
#46
_Yella SLuR_
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 12:30 PM
Don't forget to factor in the torsional load imposed on the fan relative to your distance from the Equator due to the earth's gravitational fields.
#48
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 12:54 PM
Nothing useful to contribute, might as well try and bully/ridicule others, same old stuff from these 2 ^.
#49
ToRunYa
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 12:59 PM
herne! yella! your boring!
---> doors that way!
---> doors that way!
#50
_Yella SLuR_
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Posted 08 March 2006 - 01:02 PM
Come on mate ^ you serious?I suspect that too Dr Terry, as ive had to replace bearings numerous times in DC fans that have been mounted on engine side.
What DC claim and what is reality can be a little skewed as you suspect.
On a warm 30+ day, temps exiting the radiator will be 90C+ when the fans are being used. On average,about a 60C difference, this will create a corresponding density change in the air, it will be ~20% less dense on the engine side(the same fan would spin faster on the engine side). So from that variable alone(Im sure its all much more complicated than just this-enter aerodynamic factors ), the fan(pitch and rpm of motor) would have to be designed differently for optimum performance in different air temps.
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