Explain this ICE to me
Will be on the lookout for a new dizzy soon
msd dizzy clearence problems
Started by
_SSbloke_
, Jan 22 2010 03:58 PM
73 replies to this topic
#26
dattoman
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Posted 24 January 2010 - 01:51 PM
#27
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 24 January 2010 - 02:03 PM
ICE Ignition
ASS308 has picture in his build thread.
http://www.gmh-torana.com.au/forums/index.php?showtopic=30450&view=findpost&p=350150
http://www.gmh-torana.com.au/forums/index.php?showtopic=30450&view=findpost&p=398662
ASS308 has picture in his build thread.
http://www.gmh-torana.com.au/forums/index.php?showtopic=30450&view=findpost&p=350150
http://www.gmh-torana.com.au/forums/index.php?showtopic=30450&view=findpost&p=398662
#28
View GaragePosted 24 January 2010 - 07:03 PM
If anyone else is looking for alternatives to work with the MSD units (e.g. 6AL) then the Accel Street Billet 52000 series (to suit Holden V8) fits no problems whatsoever as it is significantly shorter. Just remove the internal module and connect the magnetic pickup directly to the MSD unit. You still get multiple sets of springs and stops (located under the rotor for in-car adjustment) along with adjustable/removable vacuum advance. The cap is tan in colour and perhaps not as solid feeling as the MSD one but otherwise seems to be a good dizzy, mine works a treat.
#29
_ass308_
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Posted 24 January 2010 - 07:21 PM
ok ice is better for a few reasons
. its australian made.if u have any problems,a simple phone call to the owner who cares,and will help no worries.
. shorter,longer ignition leads can be custom made for u.a simple phone call to the owner got me a longer lead from the dizzy,to the coil,with the ends on it i wanted.it arrived free of charge in the mail 3 days after my
. phone call.msd wont do that 4 u.
. the dizzys dont need to be graphed ever.free to change camshafts without having to regraph.this saves money time,and mucking around,easier to sort your car.
. its better than MSD.but also more expensive.
. i have 2 rev limiters on my system 2.a upper and lower one.flick a switch and my motor atm wont rev past 3 grand.good for when someone u dont trust is driving your car,or a
extra kill switch
. the best reason of all,they fit in toranas without hitting the lip.
. if u are in the market check it out properly,u will not be sorry u spent the money
. http://www.iceignition.com/
. its australian made.if u have any problems,a simple phone call to the owner who cares,and will help no worries.
. shorter,longer ignition leads can be custom made for u.a simple phone call to the owner got me a longer lead from the dizzy,to the coil,with the ends on it i wanted.it arrived free of charge in the mail 3 days after my
. phone call.msd wont do that 4 u.
. the dizzys dont need to be graphed ever.free to change camshafts without having to regraph.this saves money time,and mucking around,easier to sort your car.
. its better than MSD.but also more expensive.
. i have 2 rev limiters on my system 2.a upper and lower one.flick a switch and my motor atm wont rev past 3 grand.good for when someone u dont trust is driving your car,or a
extra kill switch
. the best reason of all,they fit in toranas without hitting the lip.
. if u are in the market check it out properly,u will not be sorry u spent the money
. http://www.iceignition.com/
#30
Posted 24 January 2010 - 07:37 PM
What do you mean, is the dizzy locked with the advance provided by the module?. the dizzys dont need to be graphed ever.free to change camshafts without having to regraph.this saves money time,and mucking around,easier to sort your car.
#31
dattoman
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Posted 24 January 2010 - 08:13 PM
I've had a look at the site and will be considering it
Obviously as I have an account with Rocket the MSD is alot cheaper
But this ICE looks like it might be the winner
I have a rev limiter... its my right foot... so probably the basic setup for me
Obviously as I have an account with Rocket the MSD is alot cheaper
But this ICE looks like it might be the winner
I have a rev limiter... its my right foot... so probably the basic setup for me
#32
_ass308_
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Posted 24 January 2010 - 08:43 PM
76lxhatch,the dizzy has no weights in it.u select your ignition curve with the box,buy changing a number.
ill post the ignition curve sheet,that i got,up.gimme a couple of days.someone smarter than me,might be able to explain it properly
it was all chines to me,but my dyno guy and engine builder were onto it in a flash.5mins was all it took and the dizzy was sorted for the dyno session.thats another way,it will save u money.on the dyno its a push button
affair to regraph so u dont wast time and money,and get max performance.
my engine builder was a msd man(loves ice now)and i planed to buy msd as well.at the last minute i found another direction.im not knocking msd,only saying ice is better,and u have a choice as msd isnt the only thing out
there.
ill post the ignition curve sheet,that i got,up.gimme a couple of days.someone smarter than me,might be able to explain it properly
it was all chines to me,but my dyno guy and engine builder were onto it in a flash.5mins was all it took and the dizzy was sorted for the dyno session.thats another way,it will save u money.on the dyno its a push button
affair to regraph so u dont wast time and money,and get max performance.
my engine builder was a msd man(loves ice now)and i planed to buy msd as well.at the last minute i found another direction.im not knocking msd,only saying ice is better,and u have a choice as msd isnt the only thing out
there.
#33
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 24 January 2010 - 10:00 PM
With four out of the top six engines and the best of the best engine builders in the US using ICE Ignition, what better endorsement could an ignition system have!
www.enginemasters.com
#34
_ass308_
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Posted 25 January 2010 - 07:28 PM
to true ls2lxhatch
76lxhatch.
heres the sheet that came with my system.
atm i have 20 degrees initial timing set,and i am running curve 5,to give me a total of 26 degrees at 3800rpm.if i choose to run 28 degrees i just change to number 6,or number 7 to give me 30.
we ran it at 30 degrees total on the dyno,made 10 extra hp.i dont see the point in running it at 30 to get 10 extra hp.lot easier on the motor at 26.
76lxhatch.
heres the sheet that came with my system.
atm i have 20 degrees initial timing set,and i am running curve 5,to give me a total of 26 degrees at 3800rpm.if i choose to run 28 degrees i just change to number 6,or number 7 to give me 30.
we ran it at 30 degrees total on the dyno,made 10 extra hp.i dont see the point in running it at 30 to get 10 extra hp.lot easier on the motor at 26.
#35
Posted 25 January 2010 - 07:44 PM
Pretty cool, just saves swapping springs and stops. Always interesting to see what options different manufacturers give for total timing and rpm curve
#36
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 25 January 2010 - 07:58 PM
Resisting temptation to give that list a touchup....
Half of your comparisons are either bullshit or very poorly researched ass308.
Cheers.
Half of your comparisons are either bullshit or very poorly researched ass308.
Cheers.
#37
_ass308_
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Posted 25 January 2010 - 08:00 PM
go 4 it bomber i dont mind.
whats your take on it ?
whats your take on it ?
#38
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 12:51 AM
ok ice is better for a few reasons
. its australian made.if u have any problems,a simple phone call to the owner who cares,and will help no worries. The one time i have had a small probme with one of the many MSD products i have used i gave them a quick phone call and all was sorted pretty well instantly. Turned out to be my fault for not doing something properly but they offered to send me a replacement item free of charge.
. shorter,longer ignition leads can be custom made for u.a simple phone call to the owner got me a longer lead from the dizzy,to the coil,with the ends on it i wanted.it arrived free of charge in the mail 3 days after my phone call msd wont do that 4 u. Fair enough, thats why you just buy the MSD custom kits and make them yourself....you f*ck up, its your f*ck up. The leads provided are plenty long enough for any application, i usually end up cutting them shorter than half.
. the dizzys dont need to be graphed ever.free to change camshafts without having to regraph.this saves money time,and mucking around,easier to sort your car. Same deal with MSD
. its better than MSD.but also more expensive. Sounds like your biased, as am i, i suppose, wouldent mind some proof though??
. i have 2 rev limiters on my system 2.a upper and lower one.flick a switch and my motor atm wont rev past 3 grand.good for when someone u dont trust is driving your car,or a extra kill switch So does my Digital six, there adjustable by simple pods, one for thousands one for hundreds, second (lower) rev limiter can be wired into anything. Plus it has several other features that i know for a fact your ICE box doesnt have.
. the best reason of all,they fit in toranas without hitting the lip.Cant argue with that, this comment is why i didnt say all of your comments were either bullshit or poorly researched.
. if u are in the market check it out properly,u will not be sorry u spent the money Same as above.
. http://www.iceignition.com/
I just have to say right now, i have no problem with IC&E ignitions. i do have a friend who spent quiet a bit of money getting a dizzy done up by them and it turned out to be junk, but that is the only word i have about them so i cant be biased by one oppinion. Yes i am biased towards MSD but i have used a fair few of there products and they have always given me fantastic results. If you Buy MSD gear from the states then its cheap as chips.
Personally i have a LH SL that im fitting a chev into, i will be cutting the firewall and chassis lips before i even bother, it doesnt matter to me. If i had something special like a SS, SLR, or higher again model, then i would be considering the IC&E distributer, but still running it with MSD box coil and leads.
Cheers.
#39
_ass308_
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 02:02 PM
hi bomber.
i thank u for your reply,and robust debate
its australia day and i dont want to bug anyone,so ill reply to u in a couple of days.
in the mean time im hopeing u can clarify a couple of things.as far as i know all msd dizzys have weights and springs in them for the adavance.is this true ?.if not what is the part number for one that doesnt,that fits a
350 chev or 308 ?.i was lead to belive that msd uses weights and springs,for advance,and ice does not.which is a big part of why i believe ice is better
i 100% know my dizzy has no weights or springs in it,so im not sure a msd box will run an ice dizzy,what makes u think they interchange ?
what is the system u have,and what are the extra features,it has that i dont ?
cheers
chris
i thank u for your reply,and robust debate
its australia day and i dont want to bug anyone,so ill reply to u in a couple of days.
in the mean time im hopeing u can clarify a couple of things.as far as i know all msd dizzys have weights and springs in them for the adavance.is this true ?.if not what is the part number for one that doesnt,that fits a
350 chev or 308 ?.i was lead to belive that msd uses weights and springs,for advance,and ice does not.which is a big part of why i believe ice is better
i 100% know my dizzy has no weights or springs in it,so im not sure a msd box will run an ice dizzy,what makes u think they interchange ?
what is the system u have,and what are the extra features,it has that i dont ?
cheers
chris
#40
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 02:33 PM
Gday mate, better say right now that i have nothing against you or your oppinion.
Agreed, sitting here having a beer myself and about to go back to working on the car, let the discussion continue at a later time.
Cheers.
Agreed, sitting here having a beer myself and about to go back to working on the car, let the discussion continue at a later time.
Cheers.
#41
_beergut_
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 05:26 PM
fight fight!!!!!!
FIGHT behind the lunch sheds lol
FIGHT behind the lunch sheds lol
#42
lx308
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 06:30 PM
so im not sure a msd box will run an ice dizzy,
I was told the MSD box would run an ICE dissy but there would be no advance available. That's why I didn't hook up an ICE dissy to my MSD box. The supplier called the ICE dissy "locked" as opposed to the mechanical advance in the MSD dissy.
#43
Posted 26 January 2010 - 06:42 PM
^ Yeah, you just need to have the advance available in the ignition module you choose
#44
lxsstorana
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 07:07 PM
now i know someone told me about the clearence problems on the firewall lip , i now know they werent joking as i bought the msd set up Dizzy , blaster 3 coil, 6al, 8.5 mm leads . so has anybody got any fix for this problem . cheers ss bloke
I had the same problem when I bought my hatch in 2008. I didn't build the car but choose to cut the lip to give the MSD distributor some room.
It's a 350 chev, don't know what engine mounts it has but a few minutes with the angle grinder fixed the problem. Heres some photo's.
And this is what is did to the old cap before the lip was removed.
To cut or not cut, that is the question.
#45
_ass308_
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 07:48 PM
its all good bomber
lx308,the advance thing is what i was thinking of.can u get something to give the ice dizzy electronic advance 76lxhatch ?
a ice dizzy i guess is locked in a way,but theres nothing in there,the rotor just spins,the advance comes electronically as opposed to the mechanical way of the msd.thats why they wont match,unless u get something
btw how much did u pay for the msd set up,lx308
my system was $1200 delivered
lx308,the advance thing is what i was thinking of.can u get something to give the ice dizzy electronic advance 76lxhatch ?
a ice dizzy i guess is locked in a way,but theres nothing in there,the rotor just spins,the advance comes electronically as opposed to the mechanical way of the msd.thats why they wont match,unless u get something
btw how much did u pay for the msd set up,lx308
my system was $1200 delivered
#46
dattoman
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 08:06 PM
My quote from one supplier (local auto parts store)
msd8589 rrp $520
msd6421 6al-2 rrp $479
msd8202coil rrp $110
msd8589 rrp $520
msd6421 6al-2 rrp $479
msd8202coil rrp $110
#47
Posted 26 January 2010 - 08:50 PM
Yep, an ICE module as described by you or similar alternative from another manufacturer - I'm sure one of the more expensive MSD ones must do it, isn't that what Bomber was talking about...?can u get something to give the ice dizzy electronic advance 76lxhatch ?
For anyone that wants to go with the MSD setup though I still recommend the Accel dizzy as a drop-in replacement for the MSD one and it clears the firewall easy.
#48
_SSbloke_
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 09:54 PM
now i know someone told me about the clearence problems on the firewall lip , i now know they werent joking as i bought the msd set up Dizzy , blaster 3 coil, 6al, 8.5 mm leads . so has anybody got any fix for this problem . cheers ss bloke
I had the same problem when I bought my hatch in 2008. I didn't build the car but choose to cut the lip to give the MSD distributor some room.
It's a 350 chev, don't know what engine mounts it has but a few minutes with the angle grinder fixed the problem. Heres some photo's.
And this is what is did to the old cap before the lip was removed.
To cut or not cut, that is the question.
i havent taken that much out of the lip but i bit the bullet and got the die grinder witha small cutting bevel on it and took some of the lip out. By the way that looks like the cap that they said is 1/2 an inch lower than the msd cap that comes with the pro billet dizzy . all the plug leads are hooked up but ive got another question which i will start a new post with.
#49
dattoman
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Posted 26 January 2010 - 09:59 PM
Thats a big chunk
Large cap ?
Large cap ?
#50
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Posted 27 January 2010 - 04:33 AM
Thats a big chunk
Large cap ?
Yes it's the large cap.
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