36 replies to this topic

[yel327]

There were no NP around until LJ were made but GMH made it quite clear in Service Letter 176 issued around May 1976, that the 3300 XU1 engine could be used as a replacement for any LC XU1 engine, so it is feasible some were used for that purpose. However, in the same service letter it is also clear that provision was made to supply 186 service engines with the inference being they were for EH-HR as 202 was not to be used in those vehicles. These will undoubtedly be the NG and maybe NJ stamped engines that have popped up - it is quite clear some of these were used in other 186 powered cars so the inference is that they were possibly block and piston kits and thus got used in all manner of things like HK-HG and LC XU1, hence circling back to 3300 XU1 engines being used in LC XU1 most likely being rare as there were still new 186 engine parts around later in 1973 and beyond. GMH would have made a few complete service (and short) LC XU1 engines too for both the earlier and late examples and both 3100N and NK engines have been seen over the years proving this. My guess is NG is the normal high comp 186, NJ is the 186S and NK is the XU1 186.

[xu1_lc]

NK is replacement block for Late CK xu1

[S pack]

Hi,

 

Just wondering if anyone knows of any late 71 LC XU-1s that had a 202 (3300) in them. I believe a NP replacement warranty motor could be used in late 71 XU-1s.

Is this 100% correct and was the prefix allowed NP or was it another prefix.

 

It would interesting to know if anyone has seen the NP or a 202 being used in the late 71 XU-1.

 

Thanks 

 

Pana

Taking into account GMH's 'Standard of Durability' I doubt they would have recommended or approved of an NP 202 XU1 being fitted to any LC XU1 under a warranty claim.

By the time GMH advised it's Dealers in 1973 that 3300 XU1 could be used as a service replacement for 186 XU1 there wouldn't have been any LC XU1's still under warranty.

 

Edited by S pack, 31 December 2023 - 07:21 AM.

[Pana]

Thanks for the reply's and further info.

 

Yes the NK was the documented CK replacement but i believe there are not many around and there are LC XU-1s with different block prefix's that were also used and supplied supposedly (as mentioned above). NG for example. 

 

Was there limited 186 stock??? Apparently in mid 1971 GMH said that replacement 186 engines (and Nasco) would be after the intro of the HQ's.

Did this reduce supplies for a certain period and the availability was for a different motor or block??

If so it would be interesting to know what other engines and blocks may have been used, if any other than what's been already mentioned.

 

Apparently there is also a service letter from the 22nd of July 1971 that also mentions that the 3300 XU-1 engines or the 186 XU-1 engines are suitable replacement's for the LC GTR XU-1.

 

Im no expert but i do find certain topics very interesting.

 

Im always learning something new.

 

Thanks

 

Pana 

[S pack]

Thanks for the reply's and further info.

 

Yes the NK was the documented CK replacement but i believe there are not many around and there are LC XU-1s with different block prefix's that were also used and supplied supposedly (as mentioned above). NG for example. 

 

Was there limited 186 stock??? Apparently in mid 1971 GMH said that replacement 186 engines (and Nasco) would be after the intro of the HQ's.

Did this reduce supplies for a certain period and the availability was for a different motor or block??

If so it would be interesting to know what other engines and blocks may have been used, if any other than what's been already mentioned.

 

Apparently there is also a service letter from the 22nd of July 1971 that also mentions that the 3300 XU-1 engines or the 186 XU-1 engines are suitable replacement's for the LC GTR XU-1.

 

Im no expert but i do find certain topics very interesting.

 

Im always learning something new.

 

Thanks

 

Pana 

The GMH Engine Usage Chart from 22nd July 1971 DOES NOT mention 3300 XU1 engines at all. 3300 XU1 engines did not exist at that time so impossible for one to be used in an LC XU1 before LJ Torana release in early Feb 1972.
 

It is in the May 1973 Engine Usage Chart that GMH advised Dealers that either 186 XU1 or 3300 XU1 engines could be used in LC XU1. Long after LC XU1's were out of warranty.

Edited by S pack, 31 December 2023 - 10:46 AM.

[yel327]

That 1973 service letter was all about SERVICE engines, not warranty replacement, which is what Dave is getting at. GMH sold a lot of block & piston and short engines (and long engines) to the public and mechanics to repair existing GMH vehicles that failed out of warranty. In that 1973 bulletin they talk about those “provision” 186 engines were for pre-HK (as in EH-HR) which were up to 10 years old in 1973.

[Pana]

What you say does make perfect sense.

Apparently the engine usage chart was 2 separate letters page 102 to 104 in july 1971 and then more pages after the LJ was released.

My expert friend (not) must be wrong and got the 2 parts of the GMH letters mixed up. 

 

It would be interesting to know if there are different know block prefix's used for warranty and or replacement for LC XU-1. 

Do you know of any? 

Do any members know of any?

 

I guess if someone wanted to fix their car they would take what was available at that time. Back in the day it definitely wouldn't of been a big deal for most and you would just want you car fixed asap i would imagine. I could be wrong.

[S pack]

What you say does make perfect sense.

Apparently the engine usage chart was 2 separate letters page 102 to 104 in july 1971 and then more pages after the LJ was released.

My expert friend (not) must be wrong and got the 2 parts of the GMH letters mixed up. 

 

It would be interesting to know if there are different know block prefix's used for warranty and or replacement for LC XU-1. 

Do you know of any? 

Do any members know of any?

 

I guess if someone wanted to fix their car they would take what was available at that time. Back in the day it definitely wouldn't of been a big deal for most and you would just want you car fixed asap i would imagine. I could be wrong.

You been reading Torana Tough? or your friend has.
 

[Pana]

Spot on. I confirmed this today and that's where he did see some of the comments. Is the content pretty accurate in the book? Ill be having a read soon myself.

 

I have been thinking of buying his car as he will be looking to sell it soon,

He has a NP replacement motor in the car but from my research the replacement motor should be a NK but apparently the NP or even a JP was an ok replacement according to him and his info. 

 

I have seen other prefix engines in the LC XU-1s and yes they may have been put in legitimately (so they say) but when buying a car like this for the investment required if the car matches any available documentation for that model i think that's best.

 

My other option may be to buy the car and sell the motor or maybe buy it without the motor and try find another engine or block. (or buy a replica. Stress free)

 

Defiantly a bit to think about, 

 

Its not that easy finding the info require but i do find this site very helpful. 

[S pack]

I have the book 'Torana Tough' and I have found it to be a mixed bag. The engine usage chart published in the book is a mash up of the July 1971 and the May 1973 Engine Usage Charts grafted together, which results in the reader being mislead (as your friend has) if they do not have access to the original Service Letters. Guessing both Engine Usage Charts were not published in their entirety to limit the book's total page count.

IMPO the book contains lots of useful FACTUAL info, however there is also a lot of useless ******** contributed by some 3rd parties to the author.

 

If your mate has a genuine CK XU1 grab it if you can. As for the engine, if the original is gone then you may as well have any old 186 or 202 in the engine bay.

Leave the NP 202 in it and enjoy it. If a suitably numbered CK came up for sale you could consider buying and swapping out the NP, then sell the NP to recoup some $$$$$$.

Edited by S pack, 02 January 2024 - 07:19 AM.

[yel327]

I agree with Dave. If you buy it for the right price, and it isn't a dodgied up clone, leave the NP 3300 in it, but don't break it as that block is worth decent $ to an LJ XU1 owner. Procure yourself a good 186 block for it when one pops up and keep it aside for rebuild. You could chase and pay stupid $ for a 3100N or an NK block but these aren't very common, and you might as well have a 186A, 186P, 186L or 186S block in it as a replacement block is probably not going to increase the value of the car by any more than you pay for the block. Or one of the replacements that turn up from time to time like 186N, NG, NJ etc. You can even make a 186 out of a rope seal 202 block by using a later 2850 crank in it.

[stealthxu1]

I know a bloke with a ng prefix motor for sale