Hi guys,
I'm in the process of mini tubbing my UC Torana hatch and i'm looking to gain some wheel/tyre clearance at the spring. I'm going to a 65mm ID coil over spring in the rear, but i'm trying to work out what spring rate to run. So, my question is, does anyone know what the standard and/or lowered (Pedders or King) rear spring rate is?
Any info would be greatly appreciated.
Rear Spring rate
Started by
_BLOWN V6HATCH_
, Aug 24 2011 08:26 PM
45 replies to this topic
#2
TerrA LX
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Posted 24 August 2011 - 08:30 PM
king springs have all that on their web site.
#3
_BLOWN V6HATCH_
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Posted 24 August 2011 - 09:05 PM
Are you sure? I've searched there website and can't find the info i'm looking for.
#4
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Posted 24 August 2011 - 09:10 PM
Sorry, they used to have, maybe email them.
Edited by TerrA LX, 24 August 2011 - 09:13 PM.
#5
_BLOWN V6HATCH_
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Posted 24 August 2011 - 09:18 PM
Thats Ok mate, thanks anyway. I thought i was going crazy, i looked through there website about 10 times...Yeh, i'll shoot them an email, but i just thought somebody might already know, that's all.
#7
TerrA LX
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Posted 25 August 2011 - 11:11 AM
They do list the rate for their race springs on the kings web site.
#8
_BLOWN V6HATCH_
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Posted 25 August 2011 - 12:07 PM
Something like theses.
Yep, exactly that. That's the spring rate i will be running as i just got an email back from King and a stock spring is 190lb and there lowered spring is 200lb. Thanks for that mate, much appreciated.
They do list the rate for their race springs on the kings web site.
Yeh, i've seen that and now i have a spring rate i can get the right spring. I just needed to find out what a standard and lowered spring rate was so i could get the same but in a 65mmID coil over spring. Should work nicely and give me plenty of clearance to fit my 295's under.
#9
A9X
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A fortunate run
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Posted 25 August 2011 - 02:12 PM
my old lovells are 240 lb, (LX V8 1 inch drop).
#10
_BLOWN V6HATCH_
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Posted 25 August 2011 - 05:25 PM
Is it a road/street car? How does it ride? I've been speaking with struggler and he's done exactly what i'm doing, except he used a 255lb spring, but he reckons it's too stiff. I used to have compressed standard springs in the back and it used to ride nicely, i don't want it really hard in the suspension.
#11
A9X
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Posted 26 August 2011 - 12:10 PM
It's quite stiff, but i like it that way. I run a 120 l drop tank and when over half full it really softens it up.
So if you have peoplke in the back, you should be fine, if you mostly run solo or two up, like me, it's a little stiff.
So if you have peoplke in the back, you should be fine, if you mostly run solo or two up, like me, it's a little stiff.
#12
_LXSS350_
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Posted 29 August 2011 - 12:15 AM
I would have to look at the Kmac order sheet but I think on the street cars we run a custom variable at 180lbs for the first inch of travel then build up to around 250lbs at 2 inches. But we also have variable sway bars that are cockpit adjustable from 10mm to 27mm for the rear bar and 10mm to 31mm for the front bar.
#13
A9X
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Posted 29 August 2011 - 10:07 AM
I'd be very keen on the sway bars
#14
_LXSS350_
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Posted 29 August 2011 - 02:38 PM
I'd be very keen on the sway bars
Once we have them setup I will send you some photos. Not a cheap exercise but results should make it a worthy addition to the new hatch. What are you running at the moment?
#15
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Posted 29 August 2011 - 09:58 PM
Selby fixed rear, 18mm, Custom 28 mm front mount on my own linkages .
Very keen to look at options.
Very keen to look at options.
#16
_LXSS350_
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Posted 29 August 2011 - 10:19 PM
Welby this is the basic setup we are running with the duel front/rear controller.Selby fixed rear, 18mm, Custom 28 mm front mount on my own linkages .
Very keen to look at options.
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#17
AbsynthHatch
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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:02 PM
Nice bit of kit there LXSS350 are these an off the shelf complete kit?
If so where could I purchase a similar setup?
Would be very interested to hear your oponion when tested
If so where could I purchase a similar setup?
Would be very interested to hear your oponion when tested
#18
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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:28 PM
^^ What he said 
#19
_LXSS350_
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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:42 PM
Out of the USA. Of course everything is custom as Torana's are pretty rare in the USA (except 1) LOL
Depending on config each bar is between $1k -$1.5k with duel controller and cables.
Because of very high loading the blades are very high quality spring steel. These run on a sealed bearing and needle rollers. V8 supercars use the same setup. Depending on how we go we may even automate settings, but I need to talk more with some race guys in the USA as weight is an issue. The torsion bars are hollow as every lb counts for more speed. We are running the duel cable controller for now.
http://www.hrpworld..../pdf_1432_1.pdf
Depending on config each bar is between $1k -$1.5k with duel controller and cables.
Because of very high loading the blades are very high quality spring steel. These run on a sealed bearing and needle rollers. V8 supercars use the same setup. Depending on how we go we may even automate settings, but I need to talk more with some race guys in the USA as weight is an issue. The torsion bars are hollow as every lb counts for more speed. We are running the duel cable controller for now.
http://www.hrpworld..../pdf_1432_1.pdf
Edited by LXSS350, 29 August 2011 - 11:45 PM.
#20
_rob350hatch_
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Posted 29 August 2011 - 11:47 PM
i have an adjustable front and rear kmac bar but they look a bit scary .are they worth the effort?I would have to look at the Kmac order sheet but I think on the street cars we run a custom variable at 180lbs for the first inch of travel then build up to around 250lbs at 2 inches. But we also have variable sway bars that are cockpit adjustable from 10mm to 27mm for the rear bar and 10mm to 31mm for the front bar.
#21
_LXSS350_
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Posted 30 August 2011 - 12:03 AM
Good enough for all forms of Porsche racing from Spa,GTs,Cups etc, V8 Supercars, Nascar, Factory Godzilla Nissan GTR's teams etc. Can't see why a Torana can't benefit. Like anything chasing better handling, more speed, better brakes, stronger component are all rationalised in the eye of each individuals needs.i have an adjustable front and rear kmac bar but they look a bit scary .are they worth the effort?
I would have to look at the Kmac order sheet but I think on the street cars we run a custom variable at 180lbs for the first inch of travel then build up to around 250lbs at 2 inches. But we also have variable sway bars that are cockpit adjustable from 10mm to 27mm for the rear bar and 10mm to 31mm for the front bar.
If your cruising round the streets at 60kph it may not be worth the money.
On the track each 1/10 improvement could mean a win or loose. As the fuel load and tyres change having the ability to adjust the car while competing is just another tool in the armour of getting to the flag. Because we are running all tubular fully adjustable front end we certainly like to have flexibility to dial the car in how we like it.
#22
_rob350hatch_
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Posted 30 August 2011 - 08:02 AM
i guess so i bought them years ago the complete system they called it at the motor show,springs,shocks bars.but these were for a road car and now im older i cant see their use in a road car.and my track car handles just fine i dont run a rear bar and use 180 lb springs so do you think this kmac bar would compliment the rear or make it worse.i run a 120 litre tank and have only used from full once and could feel no dramatic change in the way it behaved.
but for the original question above i allways run 180 lb and this seems to work fine
but for the original question above i allways run 180 lb and this seems to work fine
#23
_LXSS350_
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Posted 30 August 2011 - 08:51 AM
We really need to get some major track time to dial it all in and weigh up the benefits. Once we do I will report our findings.
The car has a full tube front end with coilovers and has different geometry than a standard A9X/UC type front end. The rear is pretty much standard torana with custom KMac/Bilsteins at the moment, but ultimately this will probably end up a being a 3 link system with a watts link centraliser. As most of the motors we use have good HP we tend to like what I call balanced throttle oversteer, obviously in the wet things change and these bars hopefully will help with the changing load and tyre grip.
In the std config (A9X/UC type) your not alone as it seems a lot of people prefer running no rear bar or at best a very light one (12mm or so). Its really personal preference and whatever gets you around the track the fastest. Finding the right combination between your spring selection,shock compression/rebound settings,geometry etc etc takes time and a lot of experimentation (half the fun).
On a Torana street car with low profile tyres I prefer to use much softer springs,lwr shock settings but will run bigger bars. On the track however the adjust-ability is priceless because of both the changing track grip and the big elephant in the Torana's closet "its weight transfer" especially with so much weight forward. We will fix that elephant if I ever find the funds to build the A10X that I have had planned for years.
You can see in the photo's our front cockpit adjustable bar set-up in the Corvette GT car.
The car has a full tube front end with coilovers and has different geometry than a standard A9X/UC type front end. The rear is pretty much standard torana with custom KMac/Bilsteins at the moment, but ultimately this will probably end up a being a 3 link system with a watts link centraliser. As most of the motors we use have good HP we tend to like what I call balanced throttle oversteer, obviously in the wet things change and these bars hopefully will help with the changing load and tyre grip.
In the std config (A9X/UC type) your not alone as it seems a lot of people prefer running no rear bar or at best a very light one (12mm or so). Its really personal preference and whatever gets you around the track the fastest. Finding the right combination between your spring selection,shock compression/rebound settings,geometry etc etc takes time and a lot of experimentation (half the fun).
On a Torana street car with low profile tyres I prefer to use much softer springs,lwr shock settings but will run bigger bars. On the track however the adjust-ability is priceless because of both the changing track grip and the big elephant in the Torana's closet "its weight transfer" especially with so much weight forward. We will fix that elephant if I ever find the funds to build the A10X that I have had planned for years.
You can see in the photo's our front cockpit adjustable bar set-up in the Corvette GT car.
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#24
_rob350hatch_
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Posted 30 August 2011 - 03:48 PM
very nice but very scary looks like a lot of fun.some hours have gone into that
#25
_LXSS350_
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Posted 30 August 2011 - 05:41 PM
Taken a while to dial in that Corvette but grip is good now. Unfortunately Inspector Plod has no sense of fun and wouldn't like anyone driving that round Perth streets its doesn't pass road rules of discreetness. However speed, handling and braking are definitely in the right direction that I prefer LOLvery nice but very scary looks like a lot of fun.some hours have gone into that
MCM at Eastern Creek this week.
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