Just recieved my new xmas present from Summit Racing T56 magnum gearbox i am using a Dellow bell housing and one of their new cast cross members ....its fitted to a trimatic pattern 5LT Block and the problem is i cant get the gearbox up in the tunell as it just miss the factory hole by about 40mm i have just about read every link i could find reguards the install on this site....do i have to remove and replace the rear part of the box ???? it looks like i have to cut about 40 to 50 mm back to allow the box to come up into the car but i didnt want to cut the floor as its close to the support cross brace in the floor of the car if any one can help or share some advice / tips
thanks in advance
T56 help needed
Started by
BIG KEV
, Dec 30 2012 01:37 PM
36 replies to this topic
#1
BIG KEV
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Posted 30 December 2012 - 01:37 PM
#2
antelopeslr5000
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Posted 30 December 2012 - 02:25 PM
Do you have any photos of the gearbox? The T56 does have different extension housings which will change the shifter location.
#3
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Posted 30 December 2012 - 02:33 PM
sorry no pics as i am hopeless with this computer stuff all i can tell you its a T56 magnum with the red shifter location plate on top of the box
i have pics on my phone if you like to pm me your number
i have pics on my phone if you like to pm me your number
#5
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Posted 30 December 2012 - 03:07 PM
more like the botom one but where the red part of the shifter plate is twice as long meaning you can reverse the location and it dose have a 3rd shifter location as well closer to the bell housing
#6
myss427
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Posted 30 December 2012 - 04:22 PM
You will have to cut the floor, they are too tall. Mall Wood lowers them down, but I have herd about terrible vibration problems. One of my friends here in Canberra had his panel beater mate massage the floor for a day and got his to fit with clearance, no vibrations at all! But would have been quicker and simpler to put a new top tunnel in. Also I use the as delivered shifter location and its perfect, switching it around would be too forward in my opinion. You will be surprised on how fantastic the standard shift is, better than a rip shift! Also I had to trim the cross brace a little for clearance, but you don't need to remove it. just trim back and plate it with 3mm steel.
#7
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Posted 30 December 2012 - 04:40 PM
i have been playing around all day with the shifter location and it makes no differance witch way i turn it around as i am 40mm either way out from centre of the factory hole so i guess i will leave it in its origianal postion on the box like you said and look at trimming back the cross brace
#8
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Posted 30 December 2012 - 04:51 PM
I have a T56 in mine too...but just a standard F body version..
I trimmed and boxed back in the brace a little bit too...no big deal I figured. Had to raise the tunnel just over an inch too, but I was careful not to go to far and still run the factory console at least. (Raise the floor too much and the console would hit the dash of course)
I trimmed and boxed back in the brace a little bit too...no big deal I figured. Had to raise the tunnel just over an inch too, but I was careful not to go to far and still run the factory console at least. (Raise the floor too much and the console would hit the dash of course)
#9
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Posted 30 December 2012 - 05:20 PM
by looking at it from in the car if i trim back the factory hole by 40 to 50mm it should fit .....might hit the floor cross brace to ....more cutting
#10
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 30 December 2012 - 09:54 PM
pm axistr.
He has just fitted the same engine and gearbox combo.
Pictures from this thread.
http://www.gmh-toran...ct/#entry662276
He has just fitted the same engine and gearbox combo.
Pictures from this thread.
http://www.gmh-toran...ct/#entry662276
Edited by ls2lxhatch, 30 December 2012 - 09:56 PM.
#11
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 08:02 AM
PM sent thanks
#12
myss427
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 08:29 AM
That image of the box in axistr's car looks like the trans is sitting low, mine sits about 30 mm higher and the round tube section behind the shifter comes through the floor. We measured the height of the centre line of the gearbox main shaft to the top of the floor, to get the box at the exact same height so no bad angles to induce vibration. Also you can buy a block off plate for the reverse lockout, saves a lot of space at the top of the floor, they are not required.
#13
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 08:59 AM
Thanks for all your help myss427
#14
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 01:54 PM
With the Magnum behind holden's plastic motor the set-up sits well without doing any major surgery. (Other than enlarging just a little metal from the forward side of the shifter hole). As can be seen with Lenny's (axistr) pictures the shifter lands right in the stock location and without hacking the cross brace.
To get the correct driveline angle and not have the gearbox hanging on the ground engine should be as low as possible and the shifter cover plate (red bit) will sit approx 30mm above the rear tunnel pan. Of course so many different combo's with mounts,sumps etc that nothing can be taken as across the board gospel. If like me you like a little extra clearance you can also change your engine mount design to pull the engine slightly forward which also helps with distributor to firewall clearance.
A lot of people doing these swaps pull out the grinder and gas axe as the easy solution. But after decades of hotrodding cars those days are long gone for me unless its a racecar. By looking at the whole picture and working out angles and clearances you can leave your torrie's metal pretty much intact. Bolt-on mods make it easy to put the car back to standard (if you ever need or want to). That exactly was what Lenny wanted to achieve with his power steering rack. Now seeing how SS, A9X etc are getting rare its the way I prefer to modify in 2012.
The pictures here are when rough trial fitting started. Final settings of mounts had yet to be done so 5-10mm changes might have been made. Its summer and the beach is the place to be on 40 degree+ days not playing yo-yo with the drivetrain of a torrie. LOL
To get the correct driveline angle and not have the gearbox hanging on the ground engine should be as low as possible and the shifter cover plate (red bit) will sit approx 30mm above the rear tunnel pan. Of course so many different combo's with mounts,sumps etc that nothing can be taken as across the board gospel. If like me you like a little extra clearance you can also change your engine mount design to pull the engine slightly forward which also helps with distributor to firewall clearance.
A lot of people doing these swaps pull out the grinder and gas axe as the easy solution. But after decades of hotrodding cars those days are long gone for me unless its a racecar. By looking at the whole picture and working out angles and clearances you can leave your torrie's metal pretty much intact. Bolt-on mods make it easy to put the car back to standard (if you ever need or want to). That exactly was what Lenny wanted to achieve with his power steering rack. Now seeing how SS, A9X etc are getting rare its the way I prefer to modify in 2012.
The pictures here are when rough trial fitting started. Final settings of mounts had yet to be done so 5-10mm changes might have been made. Its summer and the beach is the place to be on 40 degree+ days not playing yo-yo with the drivetrain of a torrie. LOL
#15
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 05:05 PM
Thanks LXSS350 if i knew how to post pics i would but with all the help i am getting i am sure i will fix this problem.......
Where would i get hold of those engine mounts that would move the motor forward .....if you look closely at Lennys car it was a column auto and by the look of it he just cut the hole where he needed it ....its close to the factory hole ....my car is a factory srl 4 speed and like you wrote i am not to keen on cutting the floor ...not sure what you mean by cutting of metal from the forward side of shifter hole ....to me i need to cut approx 40 to 50 back meaning just before the cross brace in the floor centre of car
Where would i get hold of those engine mounts that would move the motor forward .....if you look closely at Lennys car it was a column auto and by the look of it he just cut the hole where he needed it ....its close to the factory hole ....my car is a factory srl 4 speed and like you wrote i am not to keen on cutting the floor ...not sure what you mean by cutting of metal from the forward side of shifter hole ....to me i need to cut approx 40 to 50 back meaning just before the cross brace in the floor centre of car
#16
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 05:48 PM
My motor all though its a chev sits roughly where a 308 sits and I had to trim about 30-40 mm back to give clearance to the round casting behind the shifter, it goes through the tunnel brace. I don't know why that one fits without surgery? I put a T10 in my A9X and did not cut, but that box is two thirds the size, just had to press the side for linkage clearance only.
#17
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 06:19 PM
All my hatch's are 4 speeds originally. No difference in shape of front floor pan tunnel on any LX/LH.
The slight trim is of the original 4 speed shifter hole (forward/firewall side)
I defaced lennys photo with where I mean. Key is a lot of test fitting so best to install remove complete with K-Frame/Motor/Gbox assembly as per my photo. Be careful of all the old wives BS about Torana's being different as holden where cheap a#ses and without all the pedantic's they are all pretty much the same.
The mounts are tuff mounts (self modified) available on fleebay or several online stores. Can't remember who I actually got them from off the top of my head as it was at least a year or so ago.
www.velocityauto.com.au
I have 4 or so K-frames set-up differently so we can drop engines and gearboxes,suspension set-ups between the hatch's. Normally just store engine,gearbox,suspension set-ups complete as bottom mounting these on the hoist is a simple quick fix depending on what the car will be used for. Torana's are so simple to work on its all second nature once you have done your first hundred indecisive driveline swaps LOL. As I say the key for me is bolt-on and off mods now they are hard to find in good condition.
The slight trim is of the original 4 speed shifter hole (forward/firewall side)
I defaced lennys photo with where I mean. Key is a lot of test fitting so best to install remove complete with K-Frame/Motor/Gbox assembly as per my photo. Be careful of all the old wives BS about Torana's being different as holden where cheap a#ses and without all the pedantic's they are all pretty much the same.
The mounts are tuff mounts (self modified) available on fleebay or several online stores. Can't remember who I actually got them from off the top of my head as it was at least a year or so ago.
www.velocityauto.com.au
I have 4 or so K-frames set-up differently so we can drop engines and gearboxes,suspension set-ups between the hatch's. Normally just store engine,gearbox,suspension set-ups complete as bottom mounting these on the hoist is a simple quick fix depending on what the car will be used for. Torana's are so simple to work on its all second nature once you have done your first hundred indecisive driveline swaps LOL. As I say the key for me is bolt-on and off mods now they are hard to find in good condition.
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#18
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 06:45 PM
i need to clearly trim the oppersite of what your pointing to ....so in other words i need to trim between back of shift hole and the floor cross brace
#19
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 07:14 PM
My motor all though its a chev sits roughly where a 308 sits and I had to trim about 30-40 mm back to give clearance to the round casting behind the shifter, it goes through the tunnel brace. I don't know why that one fits without surgery? I put a T10 in my A9X and did not cut, but that box is two thirds the size, just had to press the side for linkage clearance only.
myss427
Not sure but the plastic motor is only a little more forward than a standard plastic motor. Don't have to cut or even beat any part of the tunnel and have a good 10mm+ clearance all-round. Not sure why we are talking 40mm further back. The Magnum behind the LS on the other K-frame sits in the same position and also mounts the same position. As per the photo we have the box pretty high at the rear and still running about 7 degree total uni offset with the diff pinion to gearbox angle. Once its all going we will run full throttle launches with slicks and use some shaping foam to check just how how far the pinion is moving under load and compression. As all trailing arms and mounts are adjustable we can get it to hook-up pretty well with some fine tuning. This one is only about 620hp and a daily street car so its not designed to be ballistically fast.
#20
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 07:28 PM
Just came in from the shed and all this is getting to me time for beer.....if i can explain this from under the car looking up at the rear of the gearbox where the cross brace is in the floor clear i will have to notch some out of the brace but none of you guys have spoke about this .....so what am i missing....or something is to long
#21
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 07:56 PM
Just came in from the shed and all this is getting to me time for beer.....if i can explain this from under the car looking up at the rear of the gearbox where the cross brace is in the floor clear i will have to notch some out of the brace but none of you guys have spoke about this .....so what am i missing....or something is to long
What is the part number of the gearbox you ordered. There are a few variations.
The other variable would be the bell housing.
#22
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 07:58 PM
Photos might help. But myss427 mentioned he had to cut his out. Its all guessing unless you have someone close to you that's done it and can see what is happening. Move the engine slightly forward if you don't want to cut it and keep the engine low in the K-Frame to get the right tail shaft angle.
No variations in physical dimensional specs of Magnums only for oem T56's.
No variations in physical dimensional specs of Magnums only for oem T56's.
Edited by LXSS350, 31 December 2012 - 08:01 PM.
#23
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 08:06 PM
part number of box isTUET11009
Dellow b/housing depth is about 165mm
and my standard b/housing from my m21 is 195mm
Dellow b/housing depth is about 165mm
and my standard b/housing from my m21 is 195mm
#24
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 08:12 PM
I think Jeff the Yank mentioned he had to trim the rear of the hole too, as well as the floor brace.
#25
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Posted 31 December 2012 - 08:27 PM
Jeffs is an OEM Camaro T56 not a Magnum. Two different boxes. Magnums are an aftermarket box and should not be confused with any OEM T56.
Here is a very early first test fit. You can see what I do with the engine mounts to get it low and slightly forward so it all bolts up without cutting the body sheetmetal or firewall lips etc. Having lots of K-frames that you can modify saves any mods to the body of a valuable Torana.
Here is a very early first test fit. You can see what I do with the engine mounts to get it low and slightly forward so it all bolts up without cutting the body sheetmetal or firewall lips etc. Having lots of K-frames that you can modify saves any mods to the body of a valuable Torana.
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