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355 or 383 stroker into hatchback


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#1 _newellb_

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Posted 29 February 2016 - 11:18 PM

Okay, getting closer to confirming new engine for my hatch. Would like some advise or feed back on the appropriate combo. Looking at carb setup and also need to know legalities of 355 or 383 stroker in qld. Anyone done something similar and had it approved recently.

#2 unclefestal34s

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 06:33 AM

355 -308 holden,..also depends on what cylinder heads vn style or early hq L34 type either way you can't wrong,..also depends on you want to achieve and what purpose you will use it for,.manual transmission or auto..cruiser street n strip...there all questions most reputable builders and suppliers will ask you..i'm of the belief 350hp on the street is plenty in a torana and if your half ok behind the wheel,..you will see mid 12 second passes over the quarter mile quite easily..



#3 _newellb_

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 06:49 AM

Street cruise, and occasional drag. Look to put a manual tremac behind for the transmission

#4 LXCHEV

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 07:15 AM

Agreed, these days the proven formula is 308 Holden stroked to 355. So many options and combo's to choose from. I would go VN heads if building from scratch.

Depending on how wild you go, you might have a super mild 13 second cruiser to a 10 second animal.

Good luck.

#5 Redslur

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 11:29 AM

355 is the best thing that ever happened to the 308...I love my 308's and a good 350hp one will keep you smiling all day like Festa said. I built one recently for my hatch and it was a weapon on the street and quick enough for the drags. The 355 even with a nice street hydraulic and you will achieve around 400hp. Lots of fun....



#6 Nightrain 554

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 12:01 PM

Redslur I thought you where a 308 red heads man lol have you been converted to the 355

#7 ozyozyozy

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 02:20 PM

No to 383, they can be an ok street strip engine.
The cranks have massive stroke and alot of weight which creates alot of stress.
Much cheaper an easier to go 355, easy to make 400rwhp and still maintain good drivablilty.

#8 Redslur

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 07:40 PM

Redslur I thought you where a 308 red heads man lol have you been converted to the 355

Yep love my red headed 308's for sure.  Built and had many.  But when you go 355, it is a different kettle of fish. Seeing he is asking about the 355, I will support him totally B)

 

No to 383, they can be an ok street strip engine.
The cranks have massive stroke and alot of weight which creates alot of stress.
Much cheaper an easier to go 355, easy to make 400rwhp and still maintain good drivablilty.

Easy to make 400RWHP....wow big call.  I have a genuine 550HP 355 (been engine dynoed) and it only pulled 382 RWHP through a big stall and 9 inch. I wouldn't say it is street friendly at all. A mate just had a 520hp Pavteck 355 built and it also pulled 380 RWHP. Maybe more achievable through a manual but an auto isn't easy to get 400RWHP...



#9 _newellb_

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 07:56 PM

What sort of dollars we looking at for 355....$12-15k? Any thoughts on come engines?

#10 Redslur

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 08:33 PM

Start at around 8k and work your way up if you have one built. The Pavteck one my mate had built was 14k but gauranteed 520hp. COME gear is good stuff.  My last 355 was COME..


Edited by Redslur, 01 March 2016 - 08:34 PM.


#11 _Skapinad_

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 08:36 PM

That's a lot of money for 500hp...

#12 IMORAL

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 08:51 PM

That's a lot of money for 500hp...


You really are out in the sticks arent ya

400hp rwhp is definitely achievable.
Just depends what ya wanna spend. As for streetable with that hp? frOcking oath it is.

#13 ozyozyozy

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 09:02 PM

Yes i stand by that statement, friend built a 355, vn headed, mild porting, forged steel crank(crankshaft rebuilders) scat rods, 10.5-1 comp, hydraulic roller cam, torque power duel plane manifold, 750 double pump,
Used a tremec 5 speed, 9inch with 3.7, made 398rwhp, idled at 800rpm, pulled to 7000.
Very nice little engine, really good package.
I have made 400rwhp out of a 308. engine itself is not overly special, most of the "special" parts are due to getting reliabilty for endurance events, im still using a factory cast crank.
Careful planning and talking to the right people is the key.
Come cranks are some of the heaviest on the market also. Making things heavy causes more stress and alot harder to accelerate the mass.

#14 _LS2 Hatch_

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 09:30 PM

Mine is 400 at the wheels and very street freindly, actually, really really freindly, but as my name states its an LS. Makes life very easy for power and reliability.

A mate has the same power with a standard stroke 308, very high stall and nowhere as easy on the street. In saying that he has never overhheated or had any issues, but if the weather is too hot he won't get it out, and won't risk long distance.

Really depends on what you want as an end result, and without being rude, where you got your figure from. If it just a figure that you thought sounds good, you probably don't need that much to have fun. a lot of people say they have the power, but have never dynoed the car to know.
Probably find out 300 at the wheels is plenty in a well set up car. A proper set up can can make up for power!

#15 ozyozyozy

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 09:46 PM

The figures i quoted were on dyno's, and the 355 was absolutely streetable, even my 308 when i had the heavier flywheel, wasnt difficuilt to drive.
400 with an ls is a walk in the park, the standard LS engine comes from the factory with everything people are trying to engineer into there older engines.
They have light cranks, pistons, long rods, light weight valve train, roller cam with large base circle, they are quite a good engine from the factory.

#16 rexy

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Posted 01 March 2016 - 10:50 PM

Keep in mind that you would probably want to build your engine once. It's much cheaper than cutting corners and having to do it all again when it blows up.
It's much easier to live with a big cam in a manual.
While the 355 builds are nice and will hang together if done right, the extra torque of the 383 makes for a nicer street engine.
I ran mine as a daily driver for a decade from 2001 in a LX sedan. Manual box and 3.5 geared 9 inch.
Deathly reliable and so much grunt I rarely used more than 4000 rpm. Made almost 500 hp at the crank at under 5500 rpm.
Not having to rev it hard means it's still going strong 15 years later. A genuine bargain compared to so many others horror stories.

#17 Redslur

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 11:14 AM

I guess a lot comes down to the dyno being used too. You will get varying results there too. And also the difference between a manual and auto with stall. 400RWHP out of a standard stoke 308, Wow!



#18 TK383

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 01:51 PM

A strong 383 with a manual trans will be very twitchy, I've had a couple of customers I've built 383's for pull the manuals out & stick high stalled autos in - they were much happier with the auto, found them to be much more drivable & tractable down low.

 

Tractability with a manual & 500+hp 355/383 is another issue - will hunt & jerk idling around at low rpm, depending on gearing you may even find it 'rocking' on the lope at 60km/h in top.

 

Another option is to look at a 4 speed, something like a Muncie with a taller 1st gear to tame it a little, with the torque of a well built 383 you simply do not need more than 4 gears - you end up with 1st or top being useless - by the time you gear the diff to make 1st usable top gear is too tall, gear it so top gear is not stupid & 1st becomes useless.



#19 _SLR Goat_

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 06:55 PM

Go see Pete at Horsepower Engineering at Mansfield



#20 _imj411_

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 07:55 PM

400rwhp should be a easy low 11 in a Torana I think a lot of dynos are set up wrong. I have a friend with less than 270rwhp run a 11.7in a LJ and another with 260rwkw in a full weight steet VN Calais with 3.08 diff gears run a 11.6 so there is something wrong with some of the dynos some are using, cheers Aaron.

#21 _LS1 Taxi_

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 08:18 PM

I've learnt there's a lot more to running 11's than rwhp figures.

#22 _imj411_

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 08:38 PM

Yeah true. I think there's a shit load of cars that don't put out the power there owners claim. I mentioned those cars because they had less than 400rwhp and are faster than most with higher claims and are both street cars and did it over 10 years ago. Cheers Aaron.

#23 unclefestal34s

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 09:53 PM

there's a lot happy engine dyno's out there giving customers a false read,..over years i've heard of so many people claiming to have over 600hp from there 355s and 383s on 98 pump gas,..a lot of it is a crock of shit,.the dragstrip sometimes is your best gauge,..i've watched some of these supposably 600hp cars run at the track chasing times based engine dyno figures running nowhere the hp claim only later to find on a decent engine dyno there down 60 to 70 hp that they never really had,..can be very disappointing,..the best i've seen a very strong 355 vn headed on pump gas in a full bodied flared SLR5000 with a auto run 9.89 @ 136 mph with the engine making a real 580 hp...

i run a 355 in my genuine L34  with factory heads that have been ported,.with factory L34 h&m headers with a torque power manifold 750 holley d/p on pump gas super t10 12 bolt 3.90s through the mufflers making 452 hp on the dyno running 11.1 @ 122mph car weighs 1340kg without me in it..



#24 ozyozyozy

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Posted 02 March 2016 - 10:13 PM

I dont deny dyno figures can be obscure, they are only a guide. My main reason for using a dyno is to make sure im not leaning on engine to hard.
BUT the 2 engines iv spoken about and i know of 2 others are making good power and doing a everything they are asked of plus more.
The 308 has demoralized many a stroker, yes in in its current form it lacks some down low torque, its a matter of matching the gearing to suit.
The 355 WAS a streetable engine and made very good power, doesnt matter what the dyno said, i would happily have it in a streeter and i know i would be smoking alot of cars.
Also know of another 355, 400rwhp, ran high 10's consistantly with a triamtic, it was out of the shed every 2nd weekend all year.
It can be done, careful planning of the correct combination of parts.
These are not $2k engines, but they only came apart for a freshen up not for reconstruction.

#25 _imj411_

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Posted 03 March 2016 - 06:37 AM

Not doubting your claim Ozyozyozy, Just a general comment. Great effort Unclefesta with the L34 sounds a great combo, cheers Aaron.




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