Hi all,
I've got a project car here with a bit of surface rust that I would like to do something about before it gets any worse. Unfortunalty it has to sit outside as I don't have the room to put it somewhere else at the moment.
Which would be the best way to remove the rust and than treat it so it does not come back. I've heard that primer won't work too well if it becomes wet?
Thanks
treating surface rust?
Started by
Com_VC
, Aug 25 2006 07:47 PM
5 replies to this topic
#2
_micksgtr_
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Posted 25 August 2006 - 08:11 PM
yes correct primer is useless alone when its wet, you will need something like a grinder and a wire cup brush, crimp wire if its not heavy rust, twist knot if its heavy and lots to remove. then you will need to treat it with an oil based rust preventer, most of the HI-CHEM products are really good. they have a product called rust not which is very good and cheap.
hope this helps a bit
hope this helps a bit
#3
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Posted 28 August 2006 - 08:11 PM
if you can afford it you would be best off to use a epoxy primer after you remove the rust, it seals much better than normal 2k primer and is the best for long term resto's and anything that may have to go outside, if you are wondering if its any good it is also the primer used on vehicles like new mercedes benz and bmw, there are some cheaper brands out now wich would most likely save you alot of time and money in the end, maybe try somewere like a ppg dealer and ask for the cheapest line of epoxy primers.
I use a twist knot cup brush and wire wheel in edges, door jambs etc and a stripping disc on a buff in the larger areas, I use a supercheap sandblaster ($20 +$15 for grit) for badly etched rust like were the cats pissed but its only good for small areas and needs a good compressor. after you cup brush there will probably still be rust there, just kinda polished up, you will probably notice it if you rub some sandpaper over it after you cup brush, this is not good enough, get it all clean and silver but if you are using a striping disc try and be carefull not to take out to much of the metal or leave it in one spot generating heaps of heat. give it all a rub down with about 120 and wipe over it with some acid (rust convertor). after you start seeing dry white patches come up wipe it over with a rag with water in it quickly followed by a dry rag, do it 1 panel at a time and try not to touch the treated panels, wipe your nice dried out hand over it to feel for sticky spots ( dont touch treated metal if you have girly soft moist hands) if it has sticky spots wipe them with another wet rag and then quicly dry it then wipe metho over the lot to get rid of any remaing moisture then wipe it with wax & grease remover before you prime.
Ive noticed that acid treated metal holds up better under cover than non treated metal but you should use the acid procedure the same day you prime, if you are fast enough less than 2 hours before you prime is best, but if you cant prime on the day, atleast this will make it easier to treat when the day comes if you have already treated it once.
Another good advantage of epoxy primer is you can bog over it so you dont have to rush repairs to get your primer on before it gets too late in the day, just prep the metal, prime and bog it another day.
this isnt gospel but its what I do and seems to do the trick, im no painter, I wash cars for a living but I have done lots of back yard paint stuff with good results, Im currently doing a ground up bare metal rebuild in my driveway.
Also recently I picked up a portable carport on clearance at k mart for $42, sure has made life easier and I tape drop sheets over the car wich is now under the k mart carport. the drop sheets are $1.50 each at bunnings and keep the metal fresh through the week when I dont have time to work on the car, my car has a fair bit of kustom bodywork so it requires much more welding than a usuall resto wich makes outdoors harder.
Also a couple of weeks ago I found some succses on a cold night, I scrubbed some large surface rust areas with my coles scourers, (buy heaps of these, they are 44c a pack) and some acid (just septone rust convertor) using it generously and let it sit for 1.5 hours, being a cold night it didnt dry and seemed to stay active, while still wet I scrubbed it again with some scourers and acid (wear latex gloves) and then 20 minutes later I wiped it with a wet rag the dried and methoed it and most of the rust was gone easy, this was on the custom front (grill and gaurds is now 1 peice) wich has been sitting in the driveway in bare metal under a holy tarp for 7 months.
stuff thats good to get- rust convertor, deoxadine or any strong acid for rust.( from paint supplier, supercheap or k mart)
- lots of packs of 44c scourers in the cleaning isle at coles.
-box of latex gloves. (from coles)
sheets of 80-180 grit no fil paper
twist knot cup brush from bunnings and safety glasses from go lo (dont use it without safety glasses)
lots of absorbant rags ( maybe in your luandry)
sand blaster if you have a good compressor (sandblaster from supercheap)
stripping discs if you have a buff (from a paint supplier)
if you use the sandblaster on the body try to block holes leading into the sills and stuff as its messy and lay a tarp under the work area so you can recycle the grit and save mess, you only need it on deaply etched rust and it only does small areas, make sure you wear glove and goggles and dust masks if you dont want to be sanblasted.
The treated metal should be a dull silver with blue and gold tinges.
Once again Im not a painter but these are methods I have found succsesfull doing a rebuild in my driveway.
I use a twist knot cup brush and wire wheel in edges, door jambs etc and a stripping disc on a buff in the larger areas, I use a supercheap sandblaster ($20 +$15 for grit) for badly etched rust like were the cats pissed but its only good for small areas and needs a good compressor. after you cup brush there will probably still be rust there, just kinda polished up, you will probably notice it if you rub some sandpaper over it after you cup brush, this is not good enough, get it all clean and silver but if you are using a striping disc try and be carefull not to take out to much of the metal or leave it in one spot generating heaps of heat. give it all a rub down with about 120 and wipe over it with some acid (rust convertor). after you start seeing dry white patches come up wipe it over with a rag with water in it quickly followed by a dry rag, do it 1 panel at a time and try not to touch the treated panels, wipe your nice dried out hand over it to feel for sticky spots ( dont touch treated metal if you have girly soft moist hands) if it has sticky spots wipe them with another wet rag and then quicly dry it then wipe metho over the lot to get rid of any remaing moisture then wipe it with wax & grease remover before you prime.
Ive noticed that acid treated metal holds up better under cover than non treated metal but you should use the acid procedure the same day you prime, if you are fast enough less than 2 hours before you prime is best, but if you cant prime on the day, atleast this will make it easier to treat when the day comes if you have already treated it once.
Another good advantage of epoxy primer is you can bog over it so you dont have to rush repairs to get your primer on before it gets too late in the day, just prep the metal, prime and bog it another day.
this isnt gospel but its what I do and seems to do the trick, im no painter, I wash cars for a living but I have done lots of back yard paint stuff with good results, Im currently doing a ground up bare metal rebuild in my driveway.
Also recently I picked up a portable carport on clearance at k mart for $42, sure has made life easier and I tape drop sheets over the car wich is now under the k mart carport. the drop sheets are $1.50 each at bunnings and keep the metal fresh through the week when I dont have time to work on the car, my car has a fair bit of kustom bodywork so it requires much more welding than a usuall resto wich makes outdoors harder.
Also a couple of weeks ago I found some succses on a cold night, I scrubbed some large surface rust areas with my coles scourers, (buy heaps of these, they are 44c a pack) and some acid (just septone rust convertor) using it generously and let it sit for 1.5 hours, being a cold night it didnt dry and seemed to stay active, while still wet I scrubbed it again with some scourers and acid (wear latex gloves) and then 20 minutes later I wiped it with a wet rag the dried and methoed it and most of the rust was gone easy, this was on the custom front (grill and gaurds is now 1 peice) wich has been sitting in the driveway in bare metal under a holy tarp for 7 months.
stuff thats good to get- rust convertor, deoxadine or any strong acid for rust.( from paint supplier, supercheap or k mart)
- lots of packs of 44c scourers in the cleaning isle at coles.
-box of latex gloves. (from coles)
sheets of 80-180 grit no fil paper
twist knot cup brush from bunnings and safety glasses from go lo (dont use it without safety glasses)
lots of absorbant rags ( maybe in your luandry)
sand blaster if you have a good compressor (sandblaster from supercheap)
stripping discs if you have a buff (from a paint supplier)
if you use the sandblaster on the body try to block holes leading into the sills and stuff as its messy and lay a tarp under the work area so you can recycle the grit and save mess, you only need it on deaply etched rust and it only does small areas, make sure you wear glove and goggles and dust masks if you dont want to be sanblasted.
The treated metal should be a dull silver with blue and gold tinges.
Once again Im not a painter but these are methods I have found succsesfull doing a rebuild in my driveway.
#4
TerrA LX
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Posted 28 August 2006 - 08:43 PM
^ sounds pretty much on the money to me.
#5
Com_VC
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Posted 29 August 2006 - 05:19 PM
thanks for the info. so epoxy primer will be ok if it gets wet?
#6
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Posted 29 August 2006 - 07:24 PM
yep, you can get it wet, you can wet all primer exept etch but you dont want to wet the other primers any more than you have to when you wet rub it, the epoxy can take being wet a hell of a lot more becuase its non porous and seals the metal, also, it goes on bare metal, instead of etch primer.
etch primer can not get wet and is usually directly followed by hs primer, etch primer is a acid/primer mix wich promotes primer adhesion to bare metal.
etch primer can not get wet and is usually directly followed by hs primer, etch primer is a acid/primer mix wich promotes primer adhesion to bare metal.
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