Javascript Disabled Detected

You currently have javascript disabled. Several functions may not work. Please re-enable javascript to access full functionality.

bloody aussie 4 speeds

Started by _LX8VD69_ , Nov 29 2006 01:18 PM

Prev

Please log in to reply

45 replies to this topic

#26 _Aquarius - LC_

Guests

Posted 01 December 2006 - 07:45 PM

LX... i'll give you the "good oil" on aussie boxes *intentional pun*
People bag the shit out of them, most without ever having pulled one down.
They are a good box that is very capable of holding 350 REAL horsepower if treated properly. Anything will break if it is abused.

I agree totally with Greg! In the last 17 yrs i've owned 9 toranas,3kingswoods,2commodores. All aussie 4 speeds[exept 2 trimatics],some fairly strong engines mated to them aswell,6's & 8's. I've had to replace a couple of worn out shifters over the years, But the boxes have never let me down! Touch wood

Back to top

#27 _Oldn64_

Guests

Posted 01 December 2006 - 07:57 PM

Unfortunately (for your anyway) I am agreeing with Greg again. I wish I had have been around for you early but ATF will stuff the box. Sadly you need to pull it now big time. Synthetic old will not help either.

Aussie boxes ran SAE70 from factory. Apparently Royal purple do make a SAE70 but it would be cheaper to run the gearbox on your blood.

Please keep this in mind. ATF is NOT a lubricant, it is a hydrolic fluid, very different thing. It will not lube anything. My concern is that you may have gone through the steel hardening in the cluster as well. You will need to really look at the gearbox when pulling down. What colour was the oil that came out of the box?

I cannot suggest more that the box in teh car does no more km's under its own steam otherwise it might not be long before it really exits stage left.

After years of abuse (like the banjos) without being rebuilt the pour things are bound to fail. Then people compare them to boxes and diffs which have little kms on them and state it is the box or diffs fault. how do you compare? I suggest there will be a few BW diffs in VL dieing badly in the next 10 years, and watch how the BW will get a bad name.

Think about it peoples. Dont blame a mechanical device for failing when you do nto give it a chance.

Cheers

Back to top

#28 tinkers

Admin

Administrators
3,799 posts

Name:Kerri
Location:Perth - Gold Coast - Brisbane
Car:LX Hatch & VX Clubsport & VS Ute
Joined: 04-February 07

Posted 01 December 2006 - 08:42 PM

*snip* im about ready to say enough is enough and walk away from the bloody thing. stay tuned for possible car for sale

While it sounds like it "might" be easier to walk away, just remember, you may end up buying another then you are stuck with someone elses problems and have to go through the whole thing again.

Chin up.

$8 kilo for bananas? Where? They are still $14+ here!

Back to top

#29 piquet

Forum Fixture

Members
857 posts

Location:melbourne
Joined: 30-November 06

View Garage

Posted 01 December 2006 - 08:54 PM

I will also agree with Greg.
The best Oil around at the moment for any gearbox is the Redline Blue. It is called a light weight Shockproof Oil. It works a treat and is used in Mostif not all of the Group N cars around at the moment from Cortinas through Tornas to Mustang and Comaro.

Redline Red heavy weight shockproof oil is real good for diffs.

The lightweight oil is rated as a 75W90 but has the lower internalfluid friction of a SAE 30 Motor Oil
The heavy weight is rated as a 75W250 gut has the lower internal friction of a 75W90 gear oil.

For all the good info on their products
go to www.redlineoil.com

All the range is available through out Australia. In Melbourne from Diamond Valley Auto parts, 31b Clements Ave , Bundoora. ph 9467 8900
cheers
piquet

Back to top

#30 Peterpilot

Forum Member

Members
185 posts

Name:Peter
Location:Sydney
Car:SS Hatch
Joined: 09-January 06

View Garage

Posted 01 December 2006 - 09:41 PM

A lot of people do bag the Aussie 4 speed and, in my impetuous youth, have personally destroyed 3 of them. However, I have found a new respect for them after visiting an Aussie 4 speed specialist in Blacktown many years ago.

After exchanging my dead M21 for a reco, he offered to pull down my old gearbox so I could see what went wrong. He discovered that when some monkey wrench put my box together, the roller bearings around the shaft were placed end-on-end, with the spacers at each end of the shaft instead of the bearings being separated by the spacers.

After 2 years behind a warm 308, the box finally gave up. After that, I thought the M21 wasn't such a bad thing. It should never have lasted as long as it did after being assembled incorrectly.

Back to top

#31 _Oldn64_

Guests

Posted 01 December 2006 - 09:49 PM

After exchanging my dead M21 for a reco, he offered to pull down my old gearbox so I could see what went wrong. He discovered that when some monkey wrench put my box together, the roller bearings around the shaft were placed end-on-end, with the spacers at each end of the shaft instead of the bearings being separated by the spacers.

This is actually a very common thing that happens. unfortunately alot of boxes end up mud due to it. All about attention to detail.

Cheers

Back to top

#32 Racehatch

Forum Fixture

Members
1,027 posts

Location:Adelaide
Joined: 07-November 05

Posted 01 December 2006 - 10:42 PM

please help coz im about ready to say enough is enough and walk away from the bloody thing. stay tuned for possible car for sale

Sounds like a cry for help.... Okay dude, I'm gonna throw you a life line, if your willing to pull the box out of the car, and drop it down to me, I'll be happy to pull it down and have a look for ya!

I've got a couple of contacts for parts, so im sure we can get you out of strife...

and I dont wanna hear any more talk of you selling it....

Back to top

#33 _Monkey_

Guests

Posted 01 December 2006 - 10:49 PM

^Gentleman.

Back to top

#34 _LX8VD69_

Guests

Posted 01 December 2006 - 11:15 PM

ok ive heard enough people tell me the same thing so im biting the bullet and ive sourced another aussie 4 speed, my concern is that i dont want to end up with a gear box out of a one tonner, is there any way to tell if it is from the out side? i need to get this box organised real wuick so i can drag it next weekend

and 350LH although i am putting another box in i know that with the horses im pumping out of that motor that i should still get another one reconditioned so i might just take you up on the offer, i have some bits and pieces and a good 6 cyl m20 so i think we should be able to make something let me know when you are free and what part of adelaide you are in and ill talk to you about what ive got.
cheers adam

and thanks soooooooooooooooo much 350lh i was seriously thinking about selling and buying a harley. i know damned well that it would probably be a decision i would one day regret

Back to top

#35 _devilsadvocate_

Guests

Posted 01 December 2006 - 11:35 PM

Please keep this in mind. ATF is NOT a lubricant, it is a hydrolic fluid, very different thing. It will not lube anything.

Anything that provides a protective layer that reduces friction between two materials can be considered a lubricant, atf certainly meets that criteria. Certainly it is useable as a hydraulic fluid, but it also fulfills the purpose of a lubricant in automatic gearboxes as well, there are moving parts in there that wont last too long in there without it.
Whether atf will stuff up a gearbox, or more specifically an aussie 4 speed I dont know, however, there are many successful cases of atf being used in manual boxes........do a search. Certainly many boxes made today are very oil specific and putting the wrong oil in them can wreck them, but thirty year old gearboxes?
I had atf put in my mc6 150000km ago to get past sticky synchro rings when it was cold, it worked and still going strong 320000km+ total.

Back to top

#36 FastEHHolden

Steptoe

Members
5,114 posts

Location:Central Coast NSW
Joined: 16-November 05

Posted 02 December 2006 - 06:49 AM

In fact a lot of manual boxes specify atf...my memory of it is that maybe the commodore T5 might be one?

Are you sure the all the oil didn't piss out of it and it seized/wore out from that?
Because its so thin it pisses out the rear seal.

Back to top

#37 _Oldn64_

Guests

Posted 02 December 2006 - 12:05 PM

In fact a lot of manual boxes specify atf...my memory of it is that maybe the commodore T5 might be one?

I Find it funny that the manufacturer does not specify atf in there manuals but the oil company does? something is strange there.

The box is actually a ford t5 that gives specs for dexIII as the commodore box specifys an actual oil.

Cheers

Back to top

#38 FastEHHolden

Steptoe

Members
5,114 posts

Location:Central Coast NSW
Joined: 16-November 05

Posted 02 December 2006 - 02:34 PM

I tapdanced around that by blaming my memory and using the word maybe. :blink:

Back to top

#39 A9X

A fortunate run

Members
5,024 posts

Name:Welby
Location:Perth
Joined: 09-November 05

View Garage

Posted 04 February 2009 - 10:20 PM

Sorry to drag up an old thread, i was searching for something and fell across this.

Anyway, i digress, In the last couple of comments, it is discussed that ATF shouldn't be used in manual boxes.

My TKO from Mal Wood came with ATF, and the instructions for care and maintenance from Mal tell me to use ATF.

What is' the good oil' here ( pardon the pun )

Back to top

#40 Statler

Heckler Extraordinaire

Administrators
6,319 posts

Name:Col
Location:Mackay Qld. Whitsundays for all you back packers!
Joined: 20-May 06

Posted 05 February 2009 - 12:26 AM

The good old BW 5slot from the VH/K uses ATF.

I looked something like this :huh:

when i found out. I thought the gearbox guru was taking the piss! lol

As a young fella, destroying M boxes & bango's was a regular occurance!

Back to top

#41 76lxhatch

That was easy!

Members
7,208 posts

Location:Unzud
Car:SS
Joined: 04-August 08

View Garage

Posted 05 February 2009 - 05:31 AM

I think it depends on the synchros in the specific box, apparently they are easier to crunch up with a light weight oil like ATF...?

Back to top

#42 _The Baron_

Guests

Posted 05 February 2009 - 01:34 PM

You should always follow the manufacturers spec for oil.

Ford T5 EB Fowlcan is Dex III.

When I first installed my big bore M21, I used (Penrite SIN75) not realising it was synthetic. I had second gear crunches straight away but all the other gears were fine. I dropped out and discarded $50 worth of oil to use a mineral (85) based alternative as suggested by other torana nuts. (Although my step brother from Mobil stated the sync was not the issue). This was after only a couple of hundred kilometers of travel from new.

The end result was I still had the second gear issue just as bad.

As some off you know the box crapped itself after 1400k and has been rebuilt. The second gear setup was inspected but not replaced at the time as nothing significant was noticed. Once the box was put back in service, the second gear gremlin was back to play. Grrr.

Yes I am still using the Penrite SIN75, which has obviously nothing to do with the second gear gremlin from the above experiment findings.

I am finding it leaks out of the rear main seal though. Which pointed out in some of the above posts is a problem with ATF.

Eventually it will leak no more as the level drops.

Back to top

#43 _NZ Toranaman_

Guests

Posted 05 February 2009 - 02:34 PM

I had this exact problem... I would go to take off and bang out of first.

Fixed it easily by adjusting the shifter and its never done it since... in fact I started drag racing with this manual box in late 2003 and I do around 150-170 drag races a year so by my rough calculations this box has done about 1000 drag races.
The trick is adjust it for maximum travel in first.

I run auto trans oil in my manual after a tip from a guy who has worked on these beasts since they were new.

Back to top

#44 _@milco@_

Guests

Posted 17 February 2009 - 11:26 PM

yeah i have always run mineral type oil and a small amount of AFT seems to work great ( i was told by a old panel beater mate about this trick) never had any issues with it

Back to top

#45 _glennhailstone_

Guests

Posted 11 October 2014 - 01:24 PM

Saw dust works better than banana skin.

Back to top

#46 _glennhailstone_

Guests

Posted 15 October 2014 - 07:59 AM

i spoke to my mechanic yesterday, and because its mostly happening when the oils cold he said to drop the oil and use a synthetic oil and then make sure everythings adjusted correctly. unfortunatly he booked out until the middle of january but hes gonna rebuild or instruct me to do it, my m21 i have in the shed with all new gears ready to be rebuilt so at least if things go pear shaped ill be ok. cheers every one ill let you know how it all goes tomorrow i had less trouble with my opel torquemaster behind a worked 202