Posted 11 November 2005 - 01:43 PM
Subaru - need to check lengths of racks and tie-rods.
Volvo - has apparently been used before - Matt, can we line up the Volvo wrecker near the airport to lay out a bunch of racks to look at?
Nissan - ?
I'm sure height of mounted rack can be adjusted if necessary....
Posted 11 November 2005 - 06:56 PM
I did a ring around at the jap importers a few weeks back and after trying about 6 or 7, I had only found one importer who had a rack from a subaru liberty and found no WRX ones. I havn't gone and checked it but I really wanted to sus out the WRX ones with the optional ratios. Seems most of the front cuts get sold complete.
If anyone can track one down I can go and measure in Brissy would be good.
I found a couple of pics on the internet but took heaps of looking - it looks to be the right layout but I need to physically measure one.
I was thinking about this again the other night and almost resigned to the fact I may have to jump on a WRX forum and try to get a rack from someone who has bought a frontcut.
Posted 11 November 2005 - 10:02 PM
We still sorting the place out, but next week ill see what we got lying around. We 'should' have a wrx one, subaru maybe, plenty of nissans. What torry is it going into? And whats the optimal length?
Posted 12 November 2005 - 07:00 AM
Posted 12 November 2005 - 12:13 PM
I will try to measure my car this weekend to get and idea of the Torana size.
I am going to use the power steer pump from the ZR1 corvette on mine as it is already fitted and brand new and it is also a variable pressure pump so you get progressive rate steering which I really want.
I would suggest if te WRX rack goes, to use their pump as again they will have a progressive rate setup and it will most likely only be a case of making brackets and sorting out the pulley.
It is good to keep a whole setup complete if possible too when doing a conversion.
I believe a HQ power steering pump will not be correct although I hear people use them for the Cortina setups. I have found that pumps to suit a rack and pinion are lower pressure and higher flow than those for the recirc ball setups like the HQ. It must work but would not be ideal.
DragLC, thanks for the offer mate, sounds good.
The lengths we are interrested in for starters are:
1. the distance between inner balljoints of the rack and pinion (between the actual pivot points)
2. The distance between the mountings for the rack.
3. The height from the mountings to the centrline of the rack.
4. The length of the tie rods (from inner balljoint to tierod end.) hopefully WRX, liberty, forester tie rods and balljoints will interchange then it could give a fair few combinations for these.
5. would be good if you could also try a subaru tie rod in a torana steering arm, then we would know how the tapers differ, it may need either a new taper machined in the steering arm, or a blank steering arm from harrop to be drilled for the wrx tie rod end or as I plan for mine, drill the torana arms to take a rod end with a bumpsteer adjuster.
Posted 14 November 2005 - 12:18 PM
Posted 17 November 2005 - 12:33 PM
Thanks for the offer. I'll let you know - West end is on the right side of town at least.
A guy I know has suggested a really good subiparts place over on the Northside who should have most things I could want to measure.
I tracked down the guy who put the idea of the WRX rack in my head and I am going to go an visit on Saturday morning to check it all out.
He has it jigg'ed up on an LX front end at the moment.
He ended up using some sort of Hyundai LHD rear mount rack flipped over to mount out front on the RHS. I will give you the run down Saturday once I have checked out if I like it or not.
Edited by Toranamat69, 17 November 2005 - 12:37 PM.
Posted 20 November 2005 - 10:36 PM
Posted 25 November 2005 - 09:49 PM
I have not tried the WRX measurements or anything yet but I just picked up a cortina TF rack with pump and lines and everything for $122 today on e-bay so I can actually establish how good that setup is. It looks like it will fit and clear the bottom of the LT5 too as they are bloody wide.
I havn't measured t yet but it looks to be a really easy conversion.
Certainly nothing that needs CRS's intervention for $400.
Posted 25 November 2005 - 10:43 PM
Once your bumpsteer curve is non- ideal which is most cars, then ride height also effects bumpsteer.
I will try to hunt down the subaru racks next week for comparison.
Posted 25 November 2005 - 10:48 PM
The guy was using a Hyundai elantra LHD rack which measures the same between inner balljoints but I thought he had a long way to go and I also believe he had bumpsteer issues not yet resolved. The Cortina setup is far better on first investigation.
Posted 26 November 2005 - 07:25 PM
Posted 28 November 2005 - 06:56 PM
I picked up UC front end on saturday with steering rack to do all my testing on which will ultimately be the one that goes in my car - and I now have the Cortina power rack. I pretty much have 2 full UC front ends to play with now.
I am going to go on the jap importers mission shortly to see what front mount power racks I can find - I measured up the LC rack as well.
Let me know of any good candidates you find in the way of power steering racks.
Posted 28 November 2005 - 07:28 PM
Posted 05 December 2005 - 12:32 PM
Posted 05 December 2005 - 07:52 PM
there are a few pics of the yellow Torana with power steer on the CTC website but only from the top looking into the engine bay.... looks great including the power steer pump but no shots from underneath - any chance of more info?
Makka, should check out how much etc, I'm sure someone will be along who wants one soon.
Posted 06 December 2005 - 10:16 AM
If your a M@ can I be a P@?
Edited by Yella SLuR, 06 December 2005 - 10:16 AM.
Posted 06 December 2005 - 11:36 PM
I finally measured up the cortina rack and it is actually 5mm shorter between the inner tie rod ends than the Torana one but I recon that would be slightly better.
The Tie rods are about 15mm longer each side on the cortina one but they have plenty of adjustment on the tierod ends and doesn't need any mods on that bit.
I really think we will struggle to find a closer match than the Cortina one though - it is pretty close to the Torana one.
It does look like it will have to mount about 1" further forward though as it is physically bigger which is potentially where some bumpsteer could come from.
If we could get a slightly longer version of the Torana steering arms it would fix the prob although lose steering directness.
For the LX we need to find a Front mount (or LHD rear mount) power rack which is between about 610 and 630mm between the inner ball joints Preferably around the 620 mark.
I don't think we will have many to choose from.
If I don't find a good Suby wrecker in Bris, I'll go to the guy in Yandina over the crissy break - he has all types of Subi's there (all late model stuff) and the racks are around $300 but he will let me take my Torana subframe up there and play around with all the parts to see what fits.
Keep the suggestions coming on other racks.
Posted 07 December 2005 - 12:28 AM
I have heard of places shortening racks so maybe that is an option.
Posted 07 December 2005 - 05:51 PM
I should be able to get down there Saturday morning and have a look.
Posted 09 December 2005 - 06:15 PM
The 96WRX rack housing is really spot on for the Torana front subframe, it tucks right in where the Torana one does really nicely - they are very simlar sized housings although the WRX tie rods are not quite as big OD but I have never heard of anyone bending one. The tie rods are about 70mm longer each side than the Torana so we would need to find soemthing else a fair bit shorter to go on there. They have very long threaded bit on the tierod ends (about 2 times the length of the Torana Tie rod end so a shorter one of them with a slightly shorter tie rod from another subi would be my first thing to check. The Torana steering arms just need to be reamed out to the subaru size as the Torana ones are heaps smaller.
Which ever way you put the rotary valve on top of the WRX rack, you will need to most likely drill 2 holes in the subframe for 2 of the hydraulic lines to exit into the subrame and come back out the sides (a good thing to hide the lines) or alternatively mount the rack a little away from the x-member and use a couple of banjo bolts for those fittings.
The distance between the inner balljoints is approx 645mm (the guy wouldn't let me remove the rubber boots for perfect measurement) so approx 10mm wider each side than the Torana rack.
If it could be mounted slightly higher (centreline approx 15 - 20mm higher then it would compensate for this but I doubt there is room for that in the Torana) - certainly isn't for mine where the engine sits about 9.5mm above the top of the torana steering rack.
Since my front end will be a complete custom setup, I will investigate moving the lower control arms out 10mm each side and then the WRX rack should be close to spot on.
Would then need 10mm longer upper control arms too. I actually wanted to increase my front track 15 to 25mm as it looked too narrow compared t the rear.
If you read those proposed new laws, they allow wider tracks to be certified if the increase is not done hanging off the wheel bearing such as with extra wheel offset.
Although we all like our deep dish wheels, this mod combined with a wheel which is further offset inwards would reduce the Scrub radius on the front end.
I almost bought the WRX rack but it looked like it needed a rebuild so I would rather lash another bit of $$ and get a nice one. If I can sort out the tie rod end options, I will most likely get one. In the meantime, I can jig up a 'dummy' WRX rack now that I have it's key masurements to see how the bumpsteer curve would look without buying one - just need a piece of steel drilled with pivots in the correct place to simulate the rack when doing measurements.
Posted 10 December 2005 - 02:29 PM
I wonder how much of the threads I could shorten and not lose too much thread engagement. Need about 35mm from each end - maybe pushing it. If I could get a rod end with just a single female thread to suit the WRX rack ends that would pretty much do the 70mm in 1 go.
Thinking about longer upper a-arms I mentioned above? does anyone know how much longer HQ to HZ upper control arms are than LX torana? as the upper bushings, balljoints and crossbars are all the same and you can buy tubular ones of them already.
Posted 10 December 2005 - 05:18 PM
Posted 11 December 2005 - 10:36 AM
At this stage I reckon I can get both setups to work pretty well - the Cortina one will be a bit heavier but a bit cheaper (but harder to find) in the long run if I was to guess the outcome.
I would like to check the later model WRX racks too - I will go up to the big subi wreckers over X-mas and check out the later ones and the tie rods from the other model subi's. I'll see what a brand new rack sets you back from subaru too as I like using new stuff where possible.
I might have to go the WRX one just for engine clearance but still not sure.
I tried another couple of racks as well at the wreckers the other day (RX7 one was one of them) but it was about 700mm between inner balljoints so way too big. I will look into the Volvo rack option but I doubt there will be anymore as close as the WRX or Cortina.
I think the aftermaket chevelle (LHD) ones you can buy from unisteer could be a goe-er still but at US$700 plus freight for a new rack I think I will keep on the WRX one for starters. You also end up with funny mounting brackets when you use a LHD rack flipped over the other way.
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