So fellas... Have the wheels fallen off on this class?
Group C/A Replica Racing - There must be a way!
Started by
Racehatch
, Nov 12 2007 06:16 PM
345 replies to this topic
#326
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Posted 22 June 2012 - 08:47 PM
#327
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Posted 24 June 2012 - 08:19 AM
i spoke to cams about the other day about making a class nd for the period 73/84 and ne for 85 till whenever group a stopped 92 or something?? the young lady there told me.its not going to happen.i gave her my email address and she said she would hook me up with the historic people but still waiting.she did listen to what i had to say but i had no luck what so ever in trying to put forward my case .that being
grp nd 72/84 following the lines of nc where cars could be replicas of the the type of car but carry no sponsorship
grp ne 85/92 the same but for grp a replicas again no sponsorship like nc.you can however replicat the paint schemes in these classes.
yeah i know the cars would look shithouse without the sponsorship on them but its a way in.it might be able to be watered down at a later stage.
group c and a cars are welcome to compete with us but we understand we are not to make false representation with regard to authenticity of any of the cars and that anyone found to be doing so would be banned for life.they are replicas.
the events would not be held where grp c and a events were being held unless under invitation from the promoters of such events.
i was told the touring car masters would eventually cater for me(yes im on $600000 a year)and that i would have to be content with my level 2 hillclimbs and sprints.and that my hatchback or xc cobra replica would be logbooked as 3j or 3d dependent on wheel width and i was also told that the marque sports cars which fit into grp s or r i cant remember now which covers till 1977 might be applicable but guess what australia has no marque sports cars(offensive???)is a 2 door cobra or a9x or derivative not a marque sports car?it has 2 doors it was purpose built was it not??so you can see where im going every possible loophole to get your replica group c car on the track has been shut,firmly!!!! unless your a private school homo that wants to race pommy shit or a 260z datto.i know i do lol.
(apparently datsun has gained "marque"status and is among the ranks of lotus,mg,triumph,morgan and the like holden/ford australia hasnt faired so well)
i was also told that the organisers of sprints and hillclimbs have nothing stopping them from making other classes and can make a grp c or a replica class per say or an invited class,however i explained to the girl that they are scared to do this because they have no cams template to follow and will not for fear of ??????????????.i say there loss.i know of a few cars that sit at home that would come out given a decent class to compete in with like cars.
there will be no grp c or a replica class unless someone with some money and marketing skills sets up a biante type breakaway group from cams like kp did with the cricket.and then if they did wouldnt it be interesting to see what the crowds feedback would be.andra and karting australia are 2 such groups that did this as well.
will our future generations want a v8 super car replica class lol
i hope this answers your question.
grp nd 72/84 following the lines of nc where cars could be replicas of the the type of car but carry no sponsorship
grp ne 85/92 the same but for grp a replicas again no sponsorship like nc.you can however replicat the paint schemes in these classes.
yeah i know the cars would look shithouse without the sponsorship on them but its a way in.it might be able to be watered down at a later stage.
group c and a cars are welcome to compete with us but we understand we are not to make false representation with regard to authenticity of any of the cars and that anyone found to be doing so would be banned for life.they are replicas.
the events would not be held where grp c and a events were being held unless under invitation from the promoters of such events.
i was told the touring car masters would eventually cater for me(yes im on $600000 a year)and that i would have to be content with my level 2 hillclimbs and sprints.and that my hatchback or xc cobra replica would be logbooked as 3j or 3d dependent on wheel width and i was also told that the marque sports cars which fit into grp s or r i cant remember now which covers till 1977 might be applicable but guess what australia has no marque sports cars(offensive???)is a 2 door cobra or a9x or derivative not a marque sports car?it has 2 doors it was purpose built was it not??so you can see where im going every possible loophole to get your replica group c car on the track has been shut,firmly!!!! unless your a private school homo that wants to race pommy shit or a 260z datto.i know i do lol.
(apparently datsun has gained "marque"status and is among the ranks of lotus,mg,triumph,morgan and the like holden/ford australia hasnt faired so well)
i was also told that the organisers of sprints and hillclimbs have nothing stopping them from making other classes and can make a grp c or a replica class per say or an invited class,however i explained to the girl that they are scared to do this because they have no cams template to follow and will not for fear of ??????????????.i say there loss.i know of a few cars that sit at home that would come out given a decent class to compete in with like cars.
there will be no grp c or a replica class unless someone with some money and marketing skills sets up a biante type breakaway group from cams like kp did with the cricket.and then if they did wouldnt it be interesting to see what the crowds feedback would be.andra and karting australia are 2 such groups that did this as well.
will our future generations want a v8 super car replica class lol
i hope this answers your question.
Edited by rob350hatch, 24 June 2012 - 08:28 AM.
#328
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Posted 24 June 2012 - 10:49 AM
I do agree with not replicating sponsorship paint schemes. I believe this is the main point of everyone getting their backs up about the class.
To be honest I think the idea of this class being built as Group C/A spec cars is the only way. Built to this spec and not replicated. I also think they would be a hit.
Is this not a template to build on touching on the hillclimb comment? If 10 of us called a hillclimb event to say we are all keen to enter our cars in the event but would like you to have a seperate class called "Group A/C Spec".
If they had a brain they would probably go 10x$$$=$$$$ which = yes. Then again
Going back to the good ol days people have a relationship with this style of motorsport mostly because they could go out and by the things on monday! Though modified on the track, they were not to far from the factory based car.
Yes they were drawn to the way the sponsored paint schemes looked (thats just advertising doing its job) but mostly to the drivers & most of all the cars!!! Now these cars are rare and Classic Muscle Cars which makes them even more popular!
I found an old LX 4 door race car that had many interesting bits & peices from the glory days. It was rough, so rough I had to have another shell next to it and buy shares in a grinding disc company. no tags but mostly there and not hot.. No history found, ran the body # with CAMS but they were no help!
I sent the car to a chap that was heavily involved in the group A/C days to be rebuilt to this spec in plain ol white! It should be finished by the end of the year.
If you like I am happy post a photo of the finished product as a potential bench mark for the class? Not saying its the best but its done by someone who did it back in the day so its going to be pretty bloody close to the spec:)
Anyway, either way I'll have it logged booked as improved production in hope that one day the above will happen!
Maybe James Packer Likes Motorsport
Regards
DaveA
To be honest I think the idea of this class being built as Group C/A spec cars is the only way. Built to this spec and not replicated. I also think they would be a hit.
Is this not a template to build on touching on the hillclimb comment? If 10 of us called a hillclimb event to say we are all keen to enter our cars in the event but would like you to have a seperate class called "Group A/C Spec".
If they had a brain they would probably go 10x$$$=$$$$ which = yes. Then again
Going back to the good ol days people have a relationship with this style of motorsport mostly because they could go out and by the things on monday! Though modified on the track, they were not to far from the factory based car.
Yes they were drawn to the way the sponsored paint schemes looked (thats just advertising doing its job) but mostly to the drivers & most of all the cars!!! Now these cars are rare and Classic Muscle Cars which makes them even more popular!
I found an old LX 4 door race car that had many interesting bits & peices from the glory days. It was rough, so rough I had to have another shell next to it and buy shares in a grinding disc company. no tags but mostly there and not hot.. No history found, ran the body # with CAMS but they were no help!
I sent the car to a chap that was heavily involved in the group A/C days to be rebuilt to this spec in plain ol white! It should be finished by the end of the year.
If you like I am happy post a photo of the finished product as a potential bench mark for the class? Not saying its the best but its done by someone who did it back in the day so its going to be pretty bloody close to the spec:)
Anyway, either way I'll have it logged booked as improved production in hope that one day the above will happen!
Maybe James Packer Likes Motorsport
Regards
DaveA
#329
_rob350hatch_
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Posted 24 June 2012 - 11:20 AM
well back to the hillclimb huntley yes it was well down on entrants for the last 2 events.my point exactly say yes to a
muscle car class
a group c/a replica class or whatever you want to call it and put it out there on the ford forums the holden forums or where ever yes i think they would get some more entrants.but for now they will just stick to the type 3 over 3000 and attract the usual crowd.
muscle car class
a group c/a replica class or whatever you want to call it and put it out there on the ford forums the holden forums or where ever yes i think they would get some more entrants.but for now they will just stick to the type 3 over 3000 and attract the usual crowd.
#330
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Posted 24 June 2012 - 01:00 PM
the thing is guys, way too much $$ already invested in Biante Muscle Car series, and there are plenty of genuine cars still available to put in a full grid.
Nothing stops you entering Imp Prod.
CAMS have no reason to look to another category.
Nothing stops you entering Imp Prod.
CAMS have no reason to look to another category.
#331
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Posted 24 June 2012 - 01:25 PM
True, my car will be logbooked to the Improved production class but completely GpC spec except the wheels obviously.
Touching on the subject above the car will be ready to go if the class ever happens... which would be awesome!!
Touching on the subject above the car will be ready to go if the class ever happens... which would be awesome!!
#332
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Posted 24 June 2012 - 08:02 PM
i know you are a few hours behind us but years?the thing is guys, way too much $$ already invested in Biante Muscle Car series, and there are plenty of genuine cars still available to put in a full grid.
Nothing stops you entering Imp Prod.
CAMS have no reason to look to another category.
why should we go in 3j mine are logbooked as sports sedans which they are not neither are they 3j.yes i still enter events in the incorrect classes i am forced to enter in or i dont get a go. but racing against fags in evos and silvias and r32's etc somehow dont work for me even when i flog their sorry little arses .it needs to change.
and mr angel will i see you at fairburn then.btw all above said in jest.so no mean replies lol
#333
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Posted 25 June 2012 - 12:24 AM
I recommend anyone to have a go at circuit racing ,choose a class that currently exists , there are many factors that will be roadblocks to starting another class , replica,s will have copyright issues , Biante TCM now caters for up to 1974 toranas and falcons , heres one that i would buy if i had more time , Biante racing is like a fulltime job !
http://www.my105.com...02/Default.aspx
Just a thought if anyone is interested , There is a cams class for group U historic sports sedans newly released which includes previously log booked cars up to 1984 , i have purchased a mid mount 650hp 350 chev LJ torana myself and am restoring and hopefully putting on the track next year , Muscle car masters will allow races for these apon a grid of 15 or more cars and it will happen !! , There are a group of these owners putting together an association atm , they are cheap now but once the field gets going , prices will rise just like the C&A cars did once the class got off the ground . i consider these as bargains and will be a hoot to drive, a good future investment..
http://www.my105.com...84/Default.aspx
http://www.my105.com...05/Default.aspx
http://www.my105.com...02/Default.aspx
there are a few more historic sports sedans available like celicas and anglia,s running 202 holdens etc on my105.com , best to get one with original log book as proving authenticity for a cams certificate is easy..
http://www.my105.com...02/Default.aspx
Just a thought if anyone is interested , There is a cams class for group U historic sports sedans newly released which includes previously log booked cars up to 1984 , i have purchased a mid mount 650hp 350 chev LJ torana myself and am restoring and hopefully putting on the track next year , Muscle car masters will allow races for these apon a grid of 15 or more cars and it will happen !! , There are a group of these owners putting together an association atm , they are cheap now but once the field gets going , prices will rise just like the C&A cars did once the class got off the ground . i consider these as bargains and will be a hoot to drive, a good future investment..
http://www.my105.com...84/Default.aspx
http://www.my105.com...05/Default.aspx
http://www.my105.com...02/Default.aspx
there are a few more historic sports sedans available like celicas and anglia,s running 202 holdens etc on my105.com , best to get one with original log book as proving authenticity for a cams certificate is easy..
#334
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Posted 25 June 2012 - 05:52 PM
I will say yes mate. I'm pretty keen to double enter the car with the old man so he can relive the glory days in a Torana around Fairburn! I'm all the way in SA now but I will get there next year for a meeting.... I hope!
Everyone has good points above. But the main one is Rob350's is that his cars have to be in IP or Sports sedans. The old man back in the very early 90's use to run his car in Sports Sedans and Ian Kell did to with the Brabam A9X. They didnt belong there but thats all there was. Now they have GpA/C Historics and everything is good for those cars but when CAMS say to do this class they just dont belong there! When the Club Cars class kicked off the old man went there and the rest is history.
Improved Production is getting more and more high tech and further away from these old cars style.
For me I'll just get the Improved Production book and have a stab. Biantie class is $$$$. No chance! Sports Sedans F#!k that! Not in my ol girl! The historic class structure will need to meet these cars at some point! Thats where I will be happy!
Cheers
Everyone has good points above. But the main one is Rob350's is that his cars have to be in IP or Sports sedans. The old man back in the very early 90's use to run his car in Sports Sedans and Ian Kell did to with the Brabam A9X. They didnt belong there but thats all there was. Now they have GpA/C Historics and everything is good for those cars but when CAMS say to do this class they just dont belong there! When the Club Cars class kicked off the old man went there and the rest is history.
Improved Production is getting more and more high tech and further away from these old cars style.
For me I'll just get the Improved Production book and have a stab. Biantie class is $$$$. No chance! Sports Sedans F#!k that! Not in my ol girl! The historic class structure will need to meet these cars at some point! Thats where I will be happy!
Cheers
#335
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Posted 25 June 2012 - 06:40 PM
if you are only in act why not give the wakefield 6hr a go its on in july 14th/15th .be good to see another torana there.
#336
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Posted 25 June 2012 - 07:09 PM
I just moved to South Australia in Feb. I go back to ACT once every 3 or so months to see the fam and i'm still sorting out a couple of loose ends there.
Would love to do the 6hr however the car wont be ready by then unfortunately! Cant rush the chap doing the resto/build!! Plus it feels like it cost more when the bills come faster
Would love to do the 6hr however the car wont be ready by then unfortunately! Cant rush the chap doing the resto/build!! Plus it feels like it cost more when the bills come faster
#337
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Posted 28 June 2012 - 05:57 AM
Rob, sprint and hill climbs up here can run the category in non-points events.........talk to Rory..........
#338
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Posted 08 July 2012 - 07:24 PM
Mmm, I've been away for a bit. Work sorta got in the way. Car is still progressing, just a bit slower than normal. Mmmm, looks like I'm not going to be going down to Nowra much anymore!!! :(
I'll keep plodding along.
I'll keep plodding along.
#339
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Posted 08 July 2012 - 07:54 PM
i know you are a few hours behind us but years?
why should we go in 3j mine are logbooked as sports sedans which they are not neither are they 3j.yes i still enter events in the incorrect classes i am forced to enter in or i dont get a go. but racing against fags in evos and silvias and r32's etc somehow dont work for me even when i flog their sorry little arses .it needs to change.
and mr angel will i see you at fairburn then.btw all above said in jest.so no mean replies lol
I hope to show a fag or 2 in IP what a Torana can do if I ever get my car done. I didn't think it would take this long to get where I am but this is my first build and you learn as you go as they say!! A 6ltr Torana is a long way from what Improved Production used to mean, against the rice burners with puffers though, I need all the HP I can get.
#340
A9X
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Posted 08 July 2012 - 11:26 PM
the old girls will do ok methinks
#341
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Posted 16 July 2012 - 10:08 PM
The RX7s unfortunately will walk all over you. On the straight, it's all rosy........hit the first turn and the smaller beast will catch and pass you.......I hope to show a fag or 2 in IP what a Torana can do if I ever get my car done. I didn't think it would take this long to get where I am but this is my first build and you learn as you go as they say!! A 6ltr Torana is a long way from what Improved Production used to mean, against the rice burners with puffers though, I need all the HP I can get.
That's not a negative, you'll never get the grin off your face after the first race!!
Les Taylor is running 7th in his A9X in NSW in O2 and 4th in early model 3000-6000cc. There are some quite capable cars running against him.
Perhaps give him a call for some pointers when you're almost ready to run. He's a top bloke and would be happ to offe advice.
Grant..
#342
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Posted 19 July 2012 - 06:44 PM
We have moved to include a Group A/C replica class in our sprint races in Qld. So far Gatton, Pittsworth,Oakey and Fraser Coast and more are including the class.It has to been seen in the spirit of the event...no LS2s in GTR or SLR Toranas for example..preferably done in period colour schemes but not neccessary...this was requested at a Club level by myself and Ralph Mounfield who runs a replica Skaife Nissan Gazelle S12....The organisers have final call but they seem to get where we are coming from...a 351 XD Vs a 308 L34 replica is a good thing..bringing more cars out of sheds to compete...we have a new player just today in an XB Falcon GT 4 door thats been locked away...it has a cam..780 Holley and extractors but not much more...he fits perfectly...yes the RX7 is a problem but we dont have many here and the ones that are have 13Bs in them so they are sports sedans...it can be done...you need to liase with the event organisers...we are seeing 20 plus etxra entrants we wouldnt have seen before...get out there and run your car against like class cars...
R
R
#343
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Posted 19 July 2012 - 06:46 PM
and the best part is...they all pit together..all get pissed together and take the micky out of each other at every opputunity at the events...and we have all become great friends...
R
R
#344
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Posted 17 August 2012 - 05:37 PM
Dear Torana friends,
im just into it ,about race classes in Germany.
Parallel to the FIA-K races we have a great semi independent race class for historic racecars.
The Youngtimer Trophy
For race and rallye.
http://www.youngtimertrophy.de/
There is a starting grid of 160 cars.
There is no need of racing history of a racecar.
Use of fibreglass body parts are free. (No carbon)
Brakes are free.
Modern suspension is allowed. (The basic fixing points have to be used as well)
Engine is free. (The block has to be original)
Aso.
Homologation papers of a used car have to be shown for a technical approval.
Uwe
im just into it ,about race classes in Germany.
Parallel to the FIA-K races we have a great semi independent race class for historic racecars.
The Youngtimer Trophy
For race and rallye.
http://www.youngtimertrophy.de/
There is a starting grid of 160 cars.
There is no need of racing history of a racecar.
Use of fibreglass body parts are free. (No carbon)
Brakes are free.
Modern suspension is allowed. (The basic fixing points have to be used as well)
Engine is free. (The block has to be original)
Aso.
Homologation papers of a used car have to be shown for a technical approval.
Uwe
#345
_rob350hatch_
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Posted 09 September 2012 - 10:13 AM
a win win.as you say 20 more entrants.the people that i deal with whinge about low entries.rory i wish you could come down here and help me with some of the bdc's that i have to deal with.We have moved to include a Group A/C replica class in our sprint races in Qld. So far Gatton, Pittsworth,Oakey and Fraser Coast and more are including the class.It has to been seen in the spirit of the event...no LS2s in GTR or SLR Toranas for example..preferably done in period colour schemes but not neccessary...this was requested at a Club level by myself and Ralph Mounfield who runs a replica Skaife Nissan Gazelle S12....The organisers have final call but they seem to get where we are coming from...a 351 XD Vs a 308 L34 replica is a good thing..bringing more cars out of sheds to compete...we have a new player just today in an XB Falcon GT 4 door thats been locked away...it has a cam..780 Holley and extractors but not much more...he fits perfectly...yes the RX7 is a problem but we dont have many here and the ones that are have 13Bs in them so they are sports sedans...it can be done...you need to liase with the event organisers...we are seeing 20 plus etxra entrants we wouldnt have seen before...get out there and run your car against like class cars...
R
"bdc's" you work it out.
#346
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Posted 12 September 2013 - 03:01 PM
Hi, I have started reading this thread but have not got through it (yet). Can you please clarify for me, the “Replica” cars we saw at MCM at Eastern Creek on 1/9 are they the type of car you are referring to in this post. Do I understand they do not have a class in which to compete at present? Were they at Eastern Creek by invitation as a demonstration category?
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