I would like to know if everyone who has a modified car if they have engineered it, mainly for NSW rego
Reason I ask is do i really need one if i have a modified car , even though the car has been checked as roadworthy and that i have noted the modifications with Shannons on the policy, does this mean they have accepted the car as it is.
Risks, Pros and Costs?
I have been told they could decline a claim if they wanted too.
Modifications are :9 inch , supra 5 speed, 14" hotwires, recaro style seats
thanks
tony
modified cars and engineering certificates NSW
Started by
tsn007
, Jul 17 2009 01:48 PM
52 replies to this topic
#1
tsn007
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Posted 17 July 2009 - 01:48 PM
#2
orangeLJ
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Posted 17 July 2009 - 01:52 PM
I think there are a bunch of loopholes,
I think you can get away with seats aslong as they use the original rails (ie. slide backward forward, mount to original holes etc) or if there is no welding involved in the conversion (they bolt to an adapter that bolts to the floor) or something like that.
the 9inch I have no idea on, I can see the issues with a housing being welded to suit another car (in the laws eyes anyway)
Wheels arent such an issue (look at the thousands of cars involved in accidents with big blingy rims, none of them are ever engineered)
I think there would have to be some circumstances involved (ie. street racing accident, big publicity etc) in the accident for them to investigate down to the point of "he had this and this and this fitted"
I think you can get away with seats aslong as they use the original rails (ie. slide backward forward, mount to original holes etc) or if there is no welding involved in the conversion (they bolt to an adapter that bolts to the floor) or something like that.
the 9inch I have no idea on, I can see the issues with a housing being welded to suit another car (in the laws eyes anyway)
Wheels arent such an issue (look at the thousands of cars involved in accidents with big blingy rims, none of them are ever engineered)
I think there would have to be some circumstances involved (ie. street racing accident, big publicity etc) in the accident for them to investigate down to the point of "he had this and this and this fitted"
#3
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Posted 17 July 2009 - 03:28 PM
with those mods it should be engineered.... 
#4
yel327
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Posted 17 July 2009 - 08:55 PM
I would have thougt only the seats would need it.
#5
_dickiep_
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Posted 17 July 2009 - 09:52 PM
i checked in SA with my car, seats are fine if they use original mounting points, supra 5 speed was fine. i dont think the hot wires will be a prob either
#6
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Posted 17 July 2009 - 09:57 PM
What about the 9 inch?
#7
TerrA LX
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 12:39 AM
Not too sure on the 9" but others will be ok.
Tony RTA used to have a separate tech dept, been years since I dealt with this thing but you may want to chase the number up and give them a call, you don't need rego numbers and the like, just a general inquiry.
Tony RTA used to have a separate tech dept, been years since I dealt with this thing but you may want to chase the number up and give them a call, you don't need rego numbers and the like, just a general inquiry.
#8
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 01:34 AM
I would expect the seats, gearbox and diff to require engineering in NSW but I do not know if that is the case. In WA and any state that adopts the NCOP the following rules apply.
Seats. (Engineer required)
NCOP7_Section_LK_Seating_and_Occy_Protection_3Feb2006.pdf
9" and Supra Gearbox. (Engineer required)
NCOP4_Section_LB_Transmissions_3Feb2006.pdf
Rims and Tyres. (Engineer is not required but the rims must be +0 to +25 mm of track. The tyres fitted to the rims must comply with the rules on pg 16 - pg 17.
NCOP11_Section_LS_Suspension_and_steering_3Feb2006.pdf
Seats. (Engineer required)
NCOP7_Section_LK_Seating_and_Occy_Protection_3Feb2006.pdf
9" and Supra Gearbox. (Engineer required)
NCOP4_Section_LB_Transmissions_3Feb2006.pdf
Rims and Tyres. (Engineer is not required but the rims must be +0 to +25 mm of track. The tyres fitted to the rims must comply with the rules on pg 16 - pg 17.
NCOP11_Section_LS_Suspension_and_steering_3Feb2006.pdf
#9
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 06:56 AM
Tony
In my torana in 2003, I had to get the 9 inch, the seats (recaro), the wheels (8 & 10 inch hotwires) the Tunnel Ram and Hole in the bonnet and the drop tank all engineered in NSW, if not engineered then insurance would not accept any claims made due the modifications..
At the moment we have "laid up" insurance with Shannons on the FJ, I have every modification listed on the policy, and it is covered.. but I am sure when the FJ is ready for rego Shannons will request the same thing....does not matter anyway as all my mods for the FJ need to be engineered anyway...
Hope this helps
Rgds
Wayne
In my torana in 2003, I had to get the 9 inch, the seats (recaro), the wheels (8 & 10 inch hotwires) the Tunnel Ram and Hole in the bonnet and the drop tank all engineered in NSW, if not engineered then insurance would not accept any claims made due the modifications..
At the moment we have "laid up" insurance with Shannons on the FJ, I have every modification listed on the policy, and it is covered.. but I am sure when the FJ is ready for rego Shannons will request the same thing....does not matter anyway as all my mods for the FJ need to be engineered anyway...
Hope this helps
Rgds
Wayne
#10
_LC Racer_
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 07:08 AM
we do engineers reports and blue slips in sydney. basically the rules are that anything that is modified beyond the original manufacture will need an engineers report.
so. if you put a nine inch in or supra five speed it will be modified. if you put different wheels on but are the same size they are fine ,but put 17inch wheels will need a report. you are allowed 15% larger engine with out a report as long as its from the same family. cheers greg
so. if you put a nine inch in or supra five speed it will be modified. if you put different wheels on but are the same size they are fine ,but put 17inch wheels will need a report. you are allowed 15% larger engine with out a report as long as its from the same family. cheers greg
#11
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 08:58 AM
The 9 inch in my car is engineered, the report was completed by Lohning Bros back in the 80's, so if an engineers repoort was required back then, I can only imagine that the rules have become stricter...
The phone number I have for RTA Technical is 1300 137 302, been a few years since I have called them, so not 100% if it is still the same number, but as Terry mentioned they used to give advice freely and were actually quite pleasant to deal with when ever I spoke with them...
The phone number I have for RTA Technical is 1300 137 302, been a few years since I have called them, so not 100% if it is still the same number, but as Terry mentioned they used to give advice freely and were actually quite pleasant to deal with when ever I spoke with them...
#12
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 09:49 AM
The phone number is still the same.
Also old engineers reports are still valid for the vehicle unless the vehicle has been modified since that report had been issued. updated reports or multiple reports can be done on the same car.
Reports cannot be swapped between vehicles .
The advantage of engineers reports are less chance of being defected by the police.
also in the event of an accident your insurance can be wiped if the vehilce has been modified and no report issues and you hanvt told your insurance company.
Also old engineers reports are still valid for the vehicle unless the vehicle has been modified since that report had been issued. updated reports or multiple reports can be done on the same car.
Reports cannot be swapped between vehicles .
The advantage of engineers reports are less chance of being defected by the police.
also in the event of an accident your insurance can be wiped if the vehilce has been modified and no report issues and you hanvt told your insurance company.
#13
tsn007
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 10:05 AM
thanks for the replies,
My point is, if have told shannons my modifications and they have been noted on the policy, they know what i have done how can they not pay a claim?
Have they not accepted the car as is ,full disclosure on my part
Also , if have a roadworthy ( pinkslip) it is deemed safe how can the Police declare it a defect
thanks
tony
My point is, if have told shannons my modifications and they have been noted on the policy, they know what i have done how can they not pay a claim?
Have they not accepted the car as is ,full disclosure on my part
Also , if have a roadworthy ( pinkslip) it is deemed safe how can the Police declare it a defect
thanks
tony
#14
_5spoke_
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 10:11 AM
I got a car that has a NSW engineering cert and has been registered in NSW.
Items listed are
a)Engine
b)transmission & driveline
c)front suspension & axles
d)rear suspension & axles
e)steering system
g)wheels and tyres
h)body & chassis
i)seating
My enginers cert covers everything except modified tunnel and and fuel tank(not sure if it needs to).
Also note seats in my car have the 2 rear mounts modified (eg holes drilled through floor) and all it needed for
cert was to have plates under the floor (big washers not even welded).
RWC and engineering cert are very different, Mechanics hand out RWC eg to make sure your car is roadworthy
and safe to use on the roads to manafactures specs. A enginer will check all modifications and make sure they are
performed to certain std to ensure the vehicle is safe.
Simply mechanics do not have knowlegde nor qualification to ensure your vehicle is safe when it has been modified.
They do not design only repair.
Items listed are
a)Engine
b)transmission & driveline
c)front suspension & axles
d)rear suspension & axles
e)steering system
g)wheels and tyres
h)body & chassis
i)seating
My enginers cert covers everything except modified tunnel and and fuel tank(not sure if it needs to).
Also note seats in my car have the 2 rear mounts modified (eg holes drilled through floor) and all it needed for
cert was to have plates under the floor (big washers not even welded).
RWC and engineering cert are very different, Mechanics hand out RWC eg to make sure your car is roadworthy
and safe to use on the roads to manafactures specs. A enginer will check all modifications and make sure they are
performed to certain std to ensure the vehicle is safe.
Simply mechanics do not have knowlegde nor qualification to ensure your vehicle is safe when it has been modified.
They do not design only repair.
Edited by 5spoke, 18 July 2009 - 10:25 AM.
#15
_Yella SLuR_
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 10:12 AM
I believe you are covered unless it is proven that the modification caused or led to the claim.
#16
TerrA LX
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 10:28 AM
Tony in situations like this I believe the onus would be on you to have the car up to scratch in the case of insurance.
As for rego, just because a car passes a pink slip does not make it road worthy.
As for rego, just because a car passes a pink slip does not make it road worthy.
#17
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 10:43 AM
Did you tell Shannons that the modifications have not been inspected by an engineer?My point is, if have told Shannons my modifications and they have been noted on the policy, they know what i have done how can they not pay a claim?
Have they not accepted the car as is ,full disclosure on my part
Also , if have a roadworthy ( pinkslip) it is deemed safe how can the Police declare it a defect
If the modifications require engineering then they are not legal unless an engineer has inspected the car and you have the report to prove it. If you can not produce the engineering report then in the eyes of the law you are driving a defective vehicle.
#18
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 03:53 PM
i agree . its the owners responsiblity to abtain and keep current engineers report on any modifications made to there motor vehicle.
If insurance companys can find a way out they will. Especailly if its a major acco or someone get injured.
If insurance companys can find a way out they will. Especailly if its a major acco or someone get injured.
Edited by LC Racer, 18 July 2009 - 03:54 PM.
#19
_moot_
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Posted 18 July 2009 - 06:26 PM
your car does not have to be engineered or legal to be insured with shannons. it just has to be in a 'roadworthy' condition.
#20
_lx5008_
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Posted 21 July 2009 - 08:54 AM
with those mods it would pass a pink slip but not a blue slip. it would only pass a blue slip with a engineering ticket. the rules are its either stock standard or its needs a engineering ticket.
#21
Redslur
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Posted 21 July 2009 - 12:02 PM
your car does not have to be engineered or legal to be insured with shannons. it just has to be in a 'roadworthy' condition
Interesting Moot becuase they told me the opposite last week. I had to get approval for my mods or a claim may be denied!
#22
tsn007
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Posted 21 July 2009 - 12:28 PM
So my next question is , does everyone have one ?
tn
tn
#23
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Posted 21 July 2009 - 07:16 PM
i reckon a lot of people dont have anything engineered. for things like a 5 speed conversions / 9 inch rear end, things that are difficult to pick out, a V8 powered UC however is another story.
#24
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Posted 22 July 2009 - 07:36 AM
We find when doing inspections that there are alot of modified cars out there not engineered.
most new cars with big wheels fall int this catorgory as well as the jap imports with blow off valves and front mount intercoolers .
most new cars with big wheels fall int this catorgory as well as the jap imports with blow off valves and front mount intercoolers .
#25
_moot_
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Posted 22 July 2009 - 09:08 AM
Interesting Moot becuase they told me the opposite last week. I had to get approval for my mods or a claim may be denied!
weird,they'll insure mine with a motor 2 foot out of the bonnet
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