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A9X Engine numbers.

Started by _exyou1_ , Feb 10 2010 05:49 PM

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#26 _sstorana_

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 12:17 PM

should be all out for every one on the forums to see and dealer codes to
i think it would help stamp the dodgy ones and cars to,
look what that president did when he was the only one with the lc lj vins disk but now we all can use the disk


Well said vin...

#27 enderwigginau

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 12:42 PM

Why do some people feel that when they are given something, ie. historical records from Holden, that they feel that no one else should be able to access them?


So no hard feelings for letting Kev scan the Parts manual mate?? Posted Image

The thief in question is a mongrel and should be flailed, and probably bastardised for other dealings.
As for the other info, I understand when people want to protect others from buying dodgy cars that were created by finding a VIN that no longer exists - luckily, most crims aren't that smart.
The problem with public access is that many people don't actually understand all the info, and can't put it together correctly. There are currently a few people floating around who purport to confirm cars, but really it's nothing more than a GMH letter confirming your details are on a file (Not aimed at anyone round here btw Posted Image )

Then you get maggots who decide that this info is opportunity for making a buck. This place exists to share much of this info and help each other, and it's disgusting that some think they can swoop in, steal info (including VIN discs etc) and reproduce it for their own benefit. If someone wanted to print off flash copies of stuff from here for the members, that would be fine, if they helped to support the forum with the proceeds and only sold at close to production costs. Those sort can bugger off and not come back.

Grant..

should be all out for every one on the forums to see and dealer codes to
i think it would help stamp the dodgy ones and cars to,
look what that president did when he was the only one with the lc lj vins disk but now we all can use the disk



If that was the case, we could tag all the entries of dodgy tags, cars and chassis that have lost their tags!! How good would that be. Obviously that is part of what the GTR/XU-1 register will be about.

Grant..

#28 REDA9X

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 12:50 PM

The information is dangerous in the wrong hands simple. The guy who has it owns it, and I trust him 100% and you won't convince him to hand it over, and why should he, it's his information.
I can see a heap of new cars "popping up" all over the place if the info was out there for all to access.
The person who stole the information from Holden has NEVER been a member of the A9X Torana Club of Australia

#29 _sstorana_

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 12:54 PM

The information is dangerous in the wrong hands simple. The guy who has it owns it, and I trust him 100% and you won't convince him to hand it over, and why should he, it's his information.
I can see a heap of new cars "popping up" all over the place if the info was out there for all to access.
The person who stole the information from Holden has NEVER been a member of the A9X Torana Club of Australia



So are you saying that the guy that you know and trust has the info on ALL LH / LX Cars, or just the A9X's?

#30 yel327

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 02:14 PM

Why do some people feel that when they are given something, ie. historical records from Holden, that they feel that no one else should be able to access them?

I have heard the story of how "someone" from the A9X Club, years ago, was given the info from Holden and then decided that no one else should see it. To me, that is very immature!!

It's a damn shame that we cannot look to see the breakdown of vehilces such as SS and SLR Toranas. I would love to know how many SS's and SLR's were produced.. I know alot of owners would love to see how "rare" or not their cars are.

I was speaking to a guy the other day that has a factory LX SL Hatch, 4.2lt Auto that is Tuxedo Black and Chamois Trim.. I think that that would be a rare car, but we have no way of checking..

Hopefully one day common sense will prevail and this info will be available..

cheers
Mick


Mick, service warranty records won't help you with paint and trim, only engine, box, diff etc like the LC/J records. If you are lucky an engine number will be there too.

#31 _sstorana_

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Posted 12 February 2010 - 02:21 PM

Mick, service warranty records won't help you with paint and trim, only engine, box, diff etc like the LC/J records. If you are lucky an engine number will be there too.



Is that it???

I was kinda hoping for the holy grail... You know, Paint, Trim, sold by, that sort of info..

Ah well, obviously not going to happen..

Although it would give us an idea of total numbers built..

cheers
Mick

#32 yel327

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 09:22 AM

They do have selling dealer, like the LC/J records. Note that most of the records around are Service/Warranty listing. The original build records don't have engine numbers either. I'm pretty sure these are still around for some models/series too.

#33 FLY_AGAIN_XU-1

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 11:00 AM

I beleive that he 'was' a member of the club, many moons ago and if memory serves me correct, he was the president at some stage.


I beleive that he 'was' a member of the association (Thats if were on the same ball park Mick) not the club, the guys in the club do a great job. The less said about the association the better........


Posted Image

R.I.P.

#34 _sstorana_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 12:22 PM


I beleive that he 'was' a member of the club, many moons ago and if memory serves me correct, he was the president at some stage.


I beleive that he 'was' a member of the association (Thats if were on the same ball park Mick) not the club, the guys in the club do a great job. The less said about the association the better........



R.I.P.



Thanks Fly,


I was beginning to think that I might have been wrong, however that person was only part of the issue.

Another person was given information, whilst in a position of office and now believes that he owns that info.

To me, that is an abuse of position!!

The arguement that new cars will 'pop' up hold very little water.. I would think that most normal people, if they were about to spend $120k plus on an A9X, they would seek out professional, independant advise from those who know the cars , and that is members of the A9X Club! I know that if I was fortunate to own one, I would seek the assistance of it's members.

I think that any 'new' car to pop up would be heavily scrutineered by the club as a matter of course anyhow.

You know what, the other thing is this.. What is knowledge, unless it is shared?? Because one day that knowledge will die with those that refuse to share it..

#35 _vin150cars_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 12:37 PM



I beleive that he 'was' a member of the club, many moons ago and if memory serves me correct, he was the president at some stage.


I beleive that he 'was' a member of the association (Thats if were on the same ball park Mick) not the club, the guys in the club do a great job. The less said about the association the better........

that is well said
vin

R.I.P.



Thanks Fly,


I was beginning to think that I might have been wrong, however that person was only part of the issue.

Another person was given information, whilst in a position of office and now believes that he owns that info.

To me, that is an abuse of position!!

The arguement that new cars will 'pop' up hold very little water.. I would think that most normal people, if they were about to spend $120k plus on an A9X, they would seek out professional, independant advise from those who know the cars , and that is members of the A9X Club! I know that if I was fortunate to own one, I would seek the assistance of it's members.

I think that any 'new' car to pop up would be heavily scrutineered by the club as a matter of course anyhow.

You know what, the other thing is this.. What is knowledge, unless it is shared?? Because one day that knowledge will die with those that refuse to share it..


#36 _The Baron_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 06:33 PM

The release of such info is a double edge sword. We can argue until the cows come home.

This is the type of scenario that happens.

That $120k car may be offered at a really good price of say $45k�.BARGIN. So the buyer gets the numbers, calls Holden or the A9X club. Holden and the A9X club would say the numbers look ok, but the A9X club would suggest the buyer has a club member check it out. But as it has already been pointed out here that at times the potential buyer wants to stay secret with such a great find because they fear others could buy it out from under them or the seller could wake up to the fact they can make so much more if an A9X �know it all� comes along for the inspection.

So the person buys it, wants to join the A9X club, has the car authenticated (looked at) but is told the car is fake. It can then all get unhappy for everyone.

So now the person owns a fake (or suss) car which the club may be asked about by the next potential owner����.what does the club tell them?��the truth of course. Now the current owner might sh!t can the club as he has lost a potential sale(s).

There is nothing worse than a fake and the misery it creates.

Now, I see nothing wrong with the �tribute� cars. It is those that go to the trouble of punching chassis numbers, engine numbers, fake plates and actually do the marketing of the vehicle as an A9X/L34/XU1 (boys toys) that need to be nailed.

Lets face it, cheap bomb ($800), $10,000 in materials and there are many talented back yard operators who could paint and polish a turd to look good and Ta Dar!!!, $45k in a bank account cleaned and close straight after.

Most would have no idea what they were looking at. The amount of guys who have come up at displays talking crap,���..yep I had an A9X�it had a factory 253 or 350chev or turbo 6 etc. Even heard of a factory L34 hatch too. ???

The issue is that if the numbers where made public, it could lubricate the scenario above by suppling a mountain of info people could simply base their purchase on. Both Holden and the A9X Club may be consulted and could give the nod but an inspection should be done before the purchase as another level of protection from fakes. There is just so much money involved these days

As for the issue with the A9X association /club custodians of this info�..I liken it to the LORD of the RINGS.

Once such power is held, it corrupts the sole.

My precious�no one can have you��..no one!.

#37 _sstorana_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 10:06 PM

Hi Baron

While I may not agree with it, I understand where you are coming from, I really do.

Unfortunately there are people out there who still think that in the field of muscle cars, there is a "bargain' to be found.. I had one recently with the BVR XU-1!!

Unfortunately fools and their money are easily parted..


Here are a couple of questions that I will pose to you..

Isn't most of the information for most of the A9X's already available? (ie, the Torana Performance Handbook?), and

Why is the other info , ie. Lh/ LX numbers, being kept away from the masses??

If you feel the need, take out the A9X and L34 (which I feel is probably more vulnerable to copy than the A9X) info..



cheers
Mick

Edited by sstorana, 13 February 2010 - 10:06 PM.

#38 REDA9X

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 10:31 PM

I THINK PEOPLE SHOULD GET THEIR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE MAKING ACCUSATIONS ABOUT HOW PEOPLE GOT INFORMATION, thats how law suits start.

#39 _sstorana_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 10:33 PM

So tell us how this individual got the info in the first place then...

#40 REDA9X

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 10:45 PM

I don't believe I should speak for the person who has been accussed of abuse of power, and I don't believe those who know nothing about it and have heard bullshit from a third party with their own agenda should comment either.

What I will say is the information belonged to this person before he was in any position of power through his own research, that is a fact.

#41 _sstorana_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 10:52 PM

I don't believe I should speak for the person who has been accussed of abuse of power, and I don't believe those who know nothing about it and have heard bullshit from a third party with their own agenda should comment either.


So tell me where I am wrong...

The person was a member and a committee member of the A9X Club,

That the person was given this info, due to there position within the A9X Club

that the person has been asked, formally on a number of occasions to hand the info back..

Are you saying that this is NOT true!!

There is no secret agenda here, all we want is the information to become available..

#42 REDA9X

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 10:55 PM

yes I am saying you are wrong, simple, those are the facts, the information was collected before he held any position, and in fact before the club even existed. Again, those people circulating that story have their own agenda.

#43 _sstorana_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 10:58 PM

yes I am saying you are wrong, simple, those are the facts, the information was collected before he held any position, and in fact before the club even existed. Again, those people circulating that story have their own agenda.



So why does he feel the need to ensure that he goes to the grave with it???

And you didn't answer my question as to the extent of the info that he holds..

#44 REDA9X

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 11:00 PM

why don't you ask him

#45 _sstorana_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 11:02 PM

Fine

PM me his number..

#46 _The Baron_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 11:02 PM

I THINK PEOPLE SHOULD GET THEIR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE MAKING ACCUSATIONS ABOUT HOW PEOPLE GOT INFORMATION, thats how law suits start.



??REDTAXI, IF you are having a swipe at me, could you get my facts straight with a PM?

Or have we read each other wrong?

Regardless, my thoughts are the A9X/L34 etc details should not be public knowledge.

What I read into sstorana's entry, he just wants the information in summary for all the other models/combination from an interest aspect. That is a lot of work! Any one prepared to pay for that.

#47 _sstorana_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 11:10 PM


I THINK PEOPLE SHOULD GET THEIR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE MAKING ACCUSATIONS ABOUT HOW PEOPLE GOT INFORMATION, thats how law suits start.



??REDTAXI, IF you are having a swipe at me, could you get my facts straight with a PM?

Or have we read each other wrong?

Regardless, my thoughts are the A9X/L34 etc details should not be public knowledge.

What I read into sstorana's entry, he just wants the information in summary for all the other models/combination from an interest aspect. That is a lot of work! Any one prepared to pay for that.


Exactly!!

and, yes, I would be prepared to do it. All 100,000 plus entries.. If it meant that we had a workable database, it would be worth the time to make it happen..


cheers
Mick

#48 REDA9X

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 11:12 PM

No baron, I am not. I just feel this sort of crap and the lies associated with it have ruined what was once a good thing, and now here it is on the net. My feeling is this, if you don't know the facts, and it has SFA to do with you, then leave it alone. The information is there, it's not being held to ransom, if someone was after info on a particular car they wanted to buy, then it's available, whats the problem? The problem is some people have spread a rumour this information was acquired while in a position of power and should be handed over is purely so they have it. It's like saying if you win a trophy at a club meeting, and then get told 12 months later you are not eligable to win it, so you should hand it back and have your name removed from it..... The guy put the information together before the club existed, paid for it, and developed it, he doesn't have to hand over anything, simple, end of arguement

#49 _sstorana_

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 11:19 PM

No baron, I am not. I just feel this sort of crap and the lies associated with it have ruined what was once a good thing, and now here it is on the net. My feeling is this, if you don't know the facts, and it has SFA to do with you, then leave it alone. The information is there, it's not being held to ransom, if someone was after info on a particular car they wanted to buy, then it's available, whats the problem? The problem is some people have spread a rumour this information was acquired while in a position of power and should be handed over is purely so they have it. It's like saying if you win a trophy at a club meeting, and then get told 12 months later you are not eligable to win it, so you should hand it back and have your name removed from it..... The guy put the information together before the club existed, paid for it, and developed it, he doesn't have to hand over anything, simple, end of arguement



still doesn't answer the question as to why we cannot get access to the data of the other LH/ LX models...

Edited by sstorana, 13 February 2010 - 11:22 PM.

#50 REDA9X

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Posted 13 February 2010 - 11:27 PM

I answered that already early in the discussion and I seriously doubt he has the time to work out every model like that and since he owns it, he can do what he likes with it. I know a second person who has it as well and I can tell you he won't hand it out because it's not in his interest finanally, not to mention that the one time he did hand out the information to help someone, that someone used it to make dodgy cars. goodnight
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