Edited by ls2lxhatch, 13 May 2010 - 10:48 AM.
a must read for everyone
Started by
_lx5008_
, May 12 2010 07:22 PM
102 replies to this topic
#26
ls2lxhatch
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 10:48 AM
If this means that items with the GM logo can not be reproduced by a third party but everything else can then in my opinion it is not as big a problem as first thought.
#27
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 11:12 AM
We should have all known it would happen tho, to do with rares, its the only way they can 100% stake there claim/spot in the market.. you see now others cant take that spot
Most people only see the products and dont bother to wonder why we see there sponsorship and ads on tv and so on everywhere..
doesnt effect me at all in what we do, but i think its wrong
I dont buy there products anyway, did a few times..didnt fit..dont bother now
so not fussed
Most people only see the products and dont bother to wonder why we see there sponsorship and ads on tv and so on everywhere..
doesnt effect me at all in what we do, but i think its wrong
I dont buy there products anyway, did a few times..didnt fit..dont bother now
so not fussed
#28
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 01:17 PM
It sounds like GMH are adopting some of the parent companys operating systems as they huddle up for the crisis ahead. Clearly the system seems to work ok in the US. There are many supplier/manufacturers of replacement/restoration auto parts for a large array of vechicles.
I don't know if our laws cater for such a system though.
Yes, this system is used in the US by GM, Ford, Chrysler, etc. If it can be implemented in America, then there is no reason why the same cannot happen here.
The biggest difference is that none of them have handed over ownership of logos to a Licensee, none of them have give out just one License. The Ford Restoration Parts Program (FRPP) has over 25 Licenses to different companys, and the GM one is similar. GM America even has a License to Pontiworld in Australia that does around 100 items under the GM Restoration banner!!
To see the extent of the GM Restoration go here..
http://www.gmrestorationparts.com/welcome.asp?session=BAC2D344A2564AF0B065C31BD0E9CE5F&d=&c=42166YHNOXFJ05C&s=
Edited by sstorana, 13 May 2010 - 01:27 PM.
#29
StephenSLR
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 01:25 PM
using the original factory tooling means they will be able to produce the exact part - not just a close copy. Well until the tool wears out of course.
Not unless they use the same materials.
Rare Spares SL/R mirror
s
#30
boomfunk
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 01:43 PM
the other thing is that they cant stop you buying other peoples products... so really they only have the market of
decals and logos..
The rest can be bought elsewhere... which is obvious with the door rubbers.. thats was there foundation for business and apparently customers have trouble with them now
So i guess its bad for the people who make decals and products with a holden logo but all else people can and will go elsewhere for the rest.. panels.. everything and then they can have there little decal market all to them selves
This is a torana family the more you buy from them the bigger they get and the most it goes to the crap..up you guys
decals and logos..
The rest can be bought elsewhere... which is obvious with the door rubbers.. thats was there foundation for business and apparently customers have trouble with them now
So i guess its bad for the people who make decals and products with a holden logo but all else people can and will go elsewhere for the rest.. panels.. everything and then they can have there little decal market all to them selves
This is a torana family the more you buy from them the bigger they get and the most it goes to the crap..up you guys
#31
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 01:50 PM
The Website that sstorana is upset about is a website for the new joint venture.
The wording is just wording...they are "the only GMH endorsed restoration parts". So what?
Endorsed is different to approved.
Holden will be getting royalties from these parts, so of course they are going to endorse them.
I would hate to see the little guy get screwed but if you produce good quality gear you're not going to lose out to HRP cr@p.......
This is only my opinion and it effects me a lot less than guys like SStorana, and I don't have all the info but that's my 2 cents.
The wording is just wording...they are "the only GMH endorsed restoration parts". So what?
Endorsed is different to approved.
Holden will be getting royalties from these parts, so of course they are going to endorse them.
I would hate to see the little guy get screwed but if you produce good quality gear you're not going to lose out to HRP cr@p.......
This is only my opinion and it effects me a lot less than guys like SStorana, and I don't have all the info but that's my 2 cents.
#32
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 08:52 PM
as above
or it may be a $$$$ grab by holden based on the yanks scheme
but if holden is endorsing this then it may work in our favor by forcing rares to lift there quality
same as holden and ford went through a program in the mid to late 90's to lift there's
i don't see to much changing
how knows some others may pay holden's fee and get endorsed too
or it may be a $$$$ grab by holden based on the yanks scheme
but if holden is endorsing this then it may work in our favor by forcing rares to lift there quality
same as holden and ford went through a program in the mid to late 90's to lift there's
i don't see to much changing
how knows some others may pay holden's fee and get endorsed too
#33
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 09:37 PM
They can't stop someone making a replacement product for any vehicle
Only stop you making a copy with their logo/trademarks on it
They can't exactly put the whole aftermarket automotive industry out of business
No-ones going to stop Bendix making pads... or Exedy making clutches... or Walker making exhausts just cause they suit a particular manufacturers vehicle
Maybe this is more an oppertunity for someone like Mick to do a deal with Rares and become a supplier to them
We all know they outsource to companies and countries all over the world to supply their stuff
Some good and some bad
So maybe this is a good oppertunity for Mick to sell his wares in larger volume to a distributor and to produce items they have no intention of making
Or improving their quality on the items they make poorly
Just a thought
It doesn't have to be doom and gloom ... theres probably alot more to it than what we've seen here so far
Only stop you making a copy with their logo/trademarks on it
They can't exactly put the whole aftermarket automotive industry out of business
No-ones going to stop Bendix making pads... or Exedy making clutches... or Walker making exhausts just cause they suit a particular manufacturers vehicle
Maybe this is more an oppertunity for someone like Mick to do a deal with Rares and become a supplier to them
We all know they outsource to companies and countries all over the world to supply their stuff
Some good and some bad
So maybe this is a good oppertunity for Mick to sell his wares in larger volume to a distributor and to produce items they have no intention of making
Or improving their quality on the items they make poorly
Just a thought
It doesn't have to be doom and gloom ... theres probably alot more to it than what we've seen here so far
#34
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 09:51 PM
They can't stop someone making a replacement product for any vehicle
Only stop you making a copy with their logo/trademarks on it
They can't exactly put the whole aftermarket automotive industry out of business
No-ones going to stop Bendix making pads... or Exedy making clutches... or Walker making exhausts just cause they suit a particular manufacturers vehicle
Maybe this is more an oppertunity for someone like Mick to do a deal with Rares and become a supplier to them
We all know they outsource to companies and countries all over the world to supply their stuff
Some good and some bad
So maybe this is a good oppertunity for Mick to sell his wares in larger volume to a distributor and to produce items they have no intention of making
Or improving their quality on the items they make poorly
Just a thought
It doesn't have to be doom and gloom ... theres probably alot more to it than what we've seen here so far
mick go on tell everyone about the deal rares wanted to do with your hatch hutchs. now thats a good story lol
#35
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 09:56 PM
All complaints regarding Rares products past, present and future should be addressed to General Manager, GM-Holden...........
Start sending them today kids
Grant..
Start sending them today kids
Grant..
#36
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Posted 13 May 2010 - 10:11 PM
hope his has alot of time on his hands lol.
#37
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 07:54 AM
mick go on tell everyone about the deal rares wanted to do with your hatch hutchs. now thats a good story lol
I won't go into the details of that on here.. Suffice to say that an agreement couldn't be reached at that time..
As for an opportunity to broaden my market exposure.. Myself and a few others are working on that in the future..
In the meantime, I am happy where my level of sales are at the moment..
I think that some have missed the point about why I am not that happy with this partnership between RSP and Holden. To me, it's more about the fact that there are other companies out there, like myself, AMCP, Torana Parts - XU-1, and others that were willing to put our products under the scrutiny of Holden, pay the License/ Royalties, an get the parts approved as GMH Restoration Parts, in an attempt to be part of a program that I believe is a good thing. The reason I believe in it is that at the end of the day, it would create competition in the industry and would create a quality control level that all would have to aspire to. That can only be to the good of everyone.. That, at this stage, is not looking like it will be happening for any of us.
The other problem is that any approvals to use a holden logo, need to go through RSP.. That in itself does not allow for competition in the market... You say, that it doesn't effect a great deal of parts, and you're right. But have a look at some of the items on your cars that do have a holden logo on them... I will put up some pictures later of an item that really needs to be done right.. However now, that cannot happen..
At the end of the day, people will look at something, regardless if it's packaged as a Rare Spares Part or a Holden Restoration Part, and if the quality is not good enough, they will not but it.
cheers
Mick
#38
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 08:40 AM
mick go on tell everyone about the deal rares wanted to do with your hatch hutchs. now thats a good story lol
At the end of the day, people will look at something, regardless if it's packaged as a Rare Spares Part or a Holden Restoration Part, and if the quality is not good enough, they will not but it.
Thats where places like this are great. To be honest when i first got into Toranas, i thought the Rare Spares stuff was great, but then after listening to people on here about the quality of parts, and them showing comparisons of each i quickly learnt that the quality of SOME of the gear is just not good enough. If i wasnt on here, i would have bought the products and just thought 'ahh thats what they must have all been like' and 'musn't have fitted from factory'
#39
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 02:46 PM
now that the word is out they must be spewing.
#40
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 03:15 PM
now that the word is out they must be spewing.
And there goes the sponsorship
#41
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 03:53 PM
now that the word is out they must be spewing.
And there goes the sponsorship
Where did that come from???
#42
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 03:56 PM
Whilst it is not normally our practice to comment on postings on the various chat sites, we would however like to do so in this instance and especially since my column in Rare Insight has been published verbatim.
Firstly, it seems there is a degree of misinformation regarding the joint venture between GM Holden and Rare Spares now officially referred to as �Holden Restoration Parts by Rare Spares�. As I stated in my column Rare Spares and GM Holden have maintained a great relationship over three decades and with their assistance we have been able to release scores of new parts, many of which have been reproduced from GM�s tooling. We in turn have produced many parts for GM Holden, including numerous LC-UC parts.
The partnership between GM Holden and Rare Spares was a natural progression from our already long term relationship. The reality is there were no other contenders who had the knowledge, funding, storage facilities or network to make the Holden Restoration Program a success. Unfortunately some of the multiple individual posts see this association as all negative which is a shame, and again there is an obvious misunderstanding of just how beneficial this partnership will be to many existing and future GM enthusiasts.
Regrettably, thousands of pieces of GM tooling were destroyed over the decades and in hindsight this was a tragedy for all of us as so many desirable parts may never be remade although we were able to rescue many pieces of tooling. This situation will no longer happen as Rare Spares now has the opportunity of using the tooling once it�s no longer required by GM. All GM enthusiasts will be able to help us determine what we should make in the future as we plan to list on the various chat sites details of all the tooling available to us. Enthusiasts will then have the opportunity of letting us know whether we should consider proceeding with the remanufacture of a particular part. We especially welcome feedback from the Car Clubs and others specialising in particular GM models. All parts remanufactured will be checked off by GM and sold in Holden Restoration Parts by Rare Spares packaging.
As far as our existing range of parts is concerned, we accept without reservation that a minority of parts were not quite as good as originals; however most have now either been improved or are in the process. It�s also worth noting that over the years it was not viable to produce some of the high cost components simply because the value of most GM models was relatively of low value and the demand was much smaller. This has since changed dramatically which is why there are so many more components now available.
We need to make it very clear at this stage that neither GM Holden nor Rare Spares have any interest in attacking the businesses of our competitors, nor do we have a history of using the chat sites to criticise our opposition or detractors. We believe in fair competition and the reality is the customer will always support the supplier who offers the best service along with highest quality parts. If others wish to manufacture parts already available through Rare Spares then that�s their business. As far as the use of GM logos are concerned and their intellectual property is concerned, yes it is a fact that GM will not allow others to use their logo and they intend to police any unauthorised use.
Some of those few posting numerous negative comments about Rare Spares may be interested to know that the Company has a significant philanthropic policy towards numerous causes. Over the years we have contributed hundreds of thousands of dollars into events including the Summernats, Muscle Car Masters, Biante/Auto Barn Touring Car Masters series racing, Drag Racing and countless car club events. Many events may not have eventuated without our support. We also heavily sponsor a number of charities and especially those involving disadvantaged children. Like any other business we are keen to make profits which helps us support our 60 staff members and to continue investing heavily in manufacturing many new products.
As General Manager of Rare Spares I invite anyone to contact me at the office (03 9305-4000) or by email ([email protected]) if there is any issue you would like to discuss with me. We have always welcomed feedback from our customers regardless of it being positive or negative.
Sincerely
David N. Rayner
Firstly, it seems there is a degree of misinformation regarding the joint venture between GM Holden and Rare Spares now officially referred to as �Holden Restoration Parts by Rare Spares�. As I stated in my column Rare Spares and GM Holden have maintained a great relationship over three decades and with their assistance we have been able to release scores of new parts, many of which have been reproduced from GM�s tooling. We in turn have produced many parts for GM Holden, including numerous LC-UC parts.
The partnership between GM Holden and Rare Spares was a natural progression from our already long term relationship. The reality is there were no other contenders who had the knowledge, funding, storage facilities or network to make the Holden Restoration Program a success. Unfortunately some of the multiple individual posts see this association as all negative which is a shame, and again there is an obvious misunderstanding of just how beneficial this partnership will be to many existing and future GM enthusiasts.
Regrettably, thousands of pieces of GM tooling were destroyed over the decades and in hindsight this was a tragedy for all of us as so many desirable parts may never be remade although we were able to rescue many pieces of tooling. This situation will no longer happen as Rare Spares now has the opportunity of using the tooling once it�s no longer required by GM. All GM enthusiasts will be able to help us determine what we should make in the future as we plan to list on the various chat sites details of all the tooling available to us. Enthusiasts will then have the opportunity of letting us know whether we should consider proceeding with the remanufacture of a particular part. We especially welcome feedback from the Car Clubs and others specialising in particular GM models. All parts remanufactured will be checked off by GM and sold in Holden Restoration Parts by Rare Spares packaging.
As far as our existing range of parts is concerned, we accept without reservation that a minority of parts were not quite as good as originals; however most have now either been improved or are in the process. It�s also worth noting that over the years it was not viable to produce some of the high cost components simply because the value of most GM models was relatively of low value and the demand was much smaller. This has since changed dramatically which is why there are so many more components now available.
We need to make it very clear at this stage that neither GM Holden nor Rare Spares have any interest in attacking the businesses of our competitors, nor do we have a history of using the chat sites to criticise our opposition or detractors. We believe in fair competition and the reality is the customer will always support the supplier who offers the best service along with highest quality parts. If others wish to manufacture parts already available through Rare Spares then that�s their business. As far as the use of GM logos are concerned and their intellectual property is concerned, yes it is a fact that GM will not allow others to use their logo and they intend to police any unauthorised use.
Some of those few posting numerous negative comments about Rare Spares may be interested to know that the Company has a significant philanthropic policy towards numerous causes. Over the years we have contributed hundreds of thousands of dollars into events including the Summernats, Muscle Car Masters, Biante/Auto Barn Touring Car Masters series racing, Drag Racing and countless car club events. Many events may not have eventuated without our support. We also heavily sponsor a number of charities and especially those involving disadvantaged children. Like any other business we are keen to make profits which helps us support our 60 staff members and to continue investing heavily in manufacturing many new products.
As General Manager of Rare Spares I invite anyone to contact me at the office (03 9305-4000) or by email ([email protected]) if there is any issue you would like to discuss with me. We have always welcomed feedback from our customers regardless of it being positive or negative.
Sincerely
David N. Rayner
#43
TerrA LX
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 04:08 PM
now that the word is out they must be spewing.
And there goes the sponsorship
Where did that come from???
Relax Mick, just joking around, but seriously as the GM just stated they sponsor alot. including this site.
I would like to see somebody, anybody, make the parts correctly, now, with feedback, thru this forum that is starting to happen...
Edited by TerrA LX, 14 May 2010 - 04:10 PM.
#44
_sstorana_
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 04:44 PM
Hello David,
Firsty, welcome to the Forums.. Probably not the best time to jump in though..
I did try and ring you, but you had gone for the weekend..
I have a couple of points for you with regards to your statement..
You stated
"The reality is there were no other contenders who had the knowledge, funding, storage facilities or network to make the Holden Restoration Program a success"
Is it not true that in the USA, the main reason that these programs work is because numerous businesses that are involved? You don't need a great deal of funding, tooling or netwrok, etc to make quality reproduction parts. You do need knowledge, drive and passion. That is something that us "smaller" companies do have lots of.
With regards to the comment,
"Rare Spares now has the opportunity of using the tooling once it�s no longer required by GM."
What does that include? Back to VT, VN?, VB?? or is it only from what they currently hold as tooling?
With regards to this comment,
"We believe in fair competition and the reality is the customer will always support the supplier who offers the best service along with highest quality parts. If others wish to manufacture parts already available through Rare Spares then that�s their business."
I do agree with you there.
With regards to this comment
"As far as the use of GM logos are concerned and their intellectual property is concerned, yes it is a fact that GM will not allow others to use their logo and they intend to police any unauthorised use."
The email that I rec'd from Holden was that any submissions to reproduce parts, that had the Holden logo on them, were to be directed thru Leith R or Greg B. If this is the case, are you going to look favourably at other competitors submissions for the use of the Holden Logos? The reason that I ask, is that there are parts out there that would possiby not be economical for RSP to make, or not on their timetable to make.
With regards to your comment
"Over the years we have contributed hundreds of thousands of dollars into events including the Summernats, Muscle Car Masters, Biante/Auto Barn Touring Car Masters series racing, Drag Racing and countless car club events. Many events may not have eventuated without our support."
One of the reasons you have been able to support those events is because of the support that we all give Rare Spares in purchasing your products.
As I have stated previously, my concern with this program is that other companies are not allowed to be part of it.
As the Owner of Torana Restorations and Accessories I invite you to contact me at anytime (0423207755) or by email ([email protected]) if there is any issue you would like to discuss with me.
regards
Mick
Firsty, welcome to the Forums.. Probably not the best time to jump in though..
I did try and ring you, but you had gone for the weekend..
I have a couple of points for you with regards to your statement..
You stated
"The reality is there were no other contenders who had the knowledge, funding, storage facilities or network to make the Holden Restoration Program a success"
Is it not true that in the USA, the main reason that these programs work is because numerous businesses that are involved? You don't need a great deal of funding, tooling or netwrok, etc to make quality reproduction parts. You do need knowledge, drive and passion. That is something that us "smaller" companies do have lots of.
With regards to the comment,
"Rare Spares now has the opportunity of using the tooling once it�s no longer required by GM."
What does that include? Back to VT, VN?, VB?? or is it only from what they currently hold as tooling?
With regards to this comment,
"We believe in fair competition and the reality is the customer will always support the supplier who offers the best service along with highest quality parts. If others wish to manufacture parts already available through Rare Spares then that�s their business."
I do agree with you there.
With regards to this comment
"As far as the use of GM logos are concerned and their intellectual property is concerned, yes it is a fact that GM will not allow others to use their logo and they intend to police any unauthorised use."
The email that I rec'd from Holden was that any submissions to reproduce parts, that had the Holden logo on them, were to be directed thru Leith R or Greg B. If this is the case, are you going to look favourably at other competitors submissions for the use of the Holden Logos? The reason that I ask, is that there are parts out there that would possiby not be economical for RSP to make, or not on their timetable to make.
With regards to your comment
"Over the years we have contributed hundreds of thousands of dollars into events including the Summernats, Muscle Car Masters, Biante/Auto Barn Touring Car Masters series racing, Drag Racing and countless car club events. Many events may not have eventuated without our support."
One of the reasons you have been able to support those events is because of the support that we all give Rare Spares in purchasing your products.
As I have stated previously, my concern with this program is that other companies are not allowed to be part of it.
As the Owner of Torana Restorations and Accessories I invite you to contact me at anytime (0423207755) or by email ([email protected]) if there is any issue you would like to discuss with me.
regards
Mick
#45
boomfunk
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 04:46 PM
dont think it changes anything.. sponsorship is advertising.. no 1 can dispute that, and yeah we all no what your saying mick, dont forget i was in the same situ also..
There is plenty of parts and products being manufactured by diff people in oz for it to not effect to many people, if it lifts the standard then great if not well they'll lose out
There is plenty of parts and products being manufactured by diff people in oz for it to not effect to many people, if it lifts the standard then great if not well they'll lose out
#46
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Posted 14 May 2010 - 09:42 PM
This has become a very interesting topic and time for all people with any interest in GM-Holden and their vehicles, as we all do have here.
Firstly, I'd like to welcome David to the forum, and as Mick said above, Maybe not under the best circumstances, but I hope that you will enjoy reading about what our community is all about, and getting a feel for what Torana (and all GM) enthusiasts here are like, and are looking for.
I can understand the great relationship that GMH has with Rare Spares, having been lucky enough to sit in the office at Rare Spares and be shown some original GMH blue prints for parts that RSP were endeavouring to make. I think it is a wonderful service that RSP have provided as a business for the past 30 years, and one i'm sure will continue long in to the future.
I also understand that economics dictates what can and cannot be done in a business REALISTICALLY, and this can be seen in the decision to, or not to re-make certain products. I'm sure most of us here understand that profits must be made to ensure the longevity and growth of any business, And as business grows so do the overheads and on-costs which must be covered by the cost of the products produced.
As You alluded to, I think the nature of these cars has changed significantly in the last 10 years from what was seen as "just another car" (Albeit often with a cult following) to a desirable, Sought-after piece of motoring history which commands prices in the vicinity of a modest home in most suburbs.
This change in the very core ethos of our cars has meant that what once was looked at as "good enough" for people back then ( and even still to this day to myself, as I do not consider myself a concourse restorer as can be seen by my projects), Is simply not good enough for the people who ARE after 100% authenticity in their concourse restorations.
I think that this venture between Rare Spares and GMH can be one of benefit for everyone, And I hope that Rare Spares can appreciate the fact mentioned above and that further investigation could be made in to combining with other niche manufacturers that may be able to target these components more easily, to provide the consumer with the best possible products at a fair and reasonable cost.
Rare Spares has been a long standing sponsor of this forum, and while this forum requires very little financial support, RSP has always been there if we were to request additional support for gifts to be given out by the forum.
This relationship has been very beneficial for both our Forum, and i hope, for your company throughout, and for this I'm sure ALL members are very appreciative as am I, and I look forward to continuing our relationship into the future.
Kind Regards
Tiny (Robert.)
Firstly, I'd like to welcome David to the forum, and as Mick said above, Maybe not under the best circumstances, but I hope that you will enjoy reading about what our community is all about, and getting a feel for what Torana (and all GM) enthusiasts here are like, and are looking for.
I can understand the great relationship that GMH has with Rare Spares, having been lucky enough to sit in the office at Rare Spares and be shown some original GMH blue prints for parts that RSP were endeavouring to make. I think it is a wonderful service that RSP have provided as a business for the past 30 years, and one i'm sure will continue long in to the future.
I also understand that economics dictates what can and cannot be done in a business REALISTICALLY, and this can be seen in the decision to, or not to re-make certain products. I'm sure most of us here understand that profits must be made to ensure the longevity and growth of any business, And as business grows so do the overheads and on-costs which must be covered by the cost of the products produced.
As You alluded to, I think the nature of these cars has changed significantly in the last 10 years from what was seen as "just another car" (Albeit often with a cult following) to a desirable, Sought-after piece of motoring history which commands prices in the vicinity of a modest home in most suburbs.
This change in the very core ethos of our cars has meant that what once was looked at as "good enough" for people back then ( and even still to this day to myself, as I do not consider myself a concourse restorer as can be seen by my projects), Is simply not good enough for the people who ARE after 100% authenticity in their concourse restorations.
I think that this venture between Rare Spares and GMH can be one of benefit for everyone, And I hope that Rare Spares can appreciate the fact mentioned above and that further investigation could be made in to combining with other niche manufacturers that may be able to target these components more easily, to provide the consumer with the best possible products at a fair and reasonable cost.
Rare Spares has been a long standing sponsor of this forum, and while this forum requires very little financial support, RSP has always been there if we were to request additional support for gifts to be given out by the forum.
This relationship has been very beneficial for both our Forum, and i hope, for your company throughout, and for this I'm sure ALL members are very appreciative as am I, and I look forward to continuing our relationship into the future.
Kind Regards
Tiny (Robert.)
#47
_l31m21vd69_
_l31m21vd69_
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Posted 17 May 2010 - 01:56 PM
so what if i need a new steering wheel for my hk monaro. rares dont do them, someone else makes the wheel but cannot make the centre horn section cause it has the holden logo on it and only rares can make it 
but if this other place makes and sells the wheel and for FREE gives away the centre horn pad. rares/holden cant do anything about that if something is given away for free. there is a away around everything and by law they cant do anthing about it.
but if this other place makes and sells the wheel and for FREE gives away the centre horn pad. rares/holden cant do anything about that if something is given away for free. there is a away around everything and by law they cant do anthing about it.
#48
MRLXSS
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The Render Garage
- Name:Matt
- Location:Upwey, Melbourne
- Car:355 LX Hatchback, DeLorean DMC-12, LX SS Hatch, VY Cross8 Crewman
- Joined: 09-November 05
Posted 17 May 2010 - 02:04 PM
Well said Tiny (Robert), thats why your our man! Totally agree with you!
Edited by MRLXSS, 17 May 2010 - 02:05 PM.
#49
_2ELCS_
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Posted 17 May 2010 - 06:03 PM
Well said Tiny (Robert), thats why your our man! Totally agree with you!
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^^^^ +1
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^^^^ +1
#50
_BCR42Y_
_BCR42Y_
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Posted 17 May 2010 - 06:14 PM
Well said Tiny (Robert), thats why your our man! Totally agree with you!
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^^^^ +2
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^^^^ +2
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