Nah you are way off again... Sorry DJ.
CSG in Queensland
Started by
_Lazarus_
, Mar 22 2015 03:28 PM
216 replies to this topic
#177
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 07:12 PM
How about you take a paycut and pay your employees some more Adam?
Halve the rent on that investment property you have?
Edited by Bomber Watson, 31 March 2015 - 07:12 PM.
#178
_Liam_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 07:17 PM
You are spectacularly missing the mark man haha.
#179
_ChaosWeaver_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 07:19 PM
Semantics ........... whether they are greedy or not doesn't really matter, why we keep letting them get away with it, for very little benefit to our country beats me.. Sure they spend money here. But when you hear about the million's of dollars on infrastructure they are going to spend in the state.. they are talking about roads and bridges and rail lines so they can move there product..... most of the money goes over sea's.... Should they pay a tax on their profits to Australians who own the Coal, Iron Ore, Gold, Diamonds, Copper, Zinc, Oil and last but not least Gas........
Have a Quik squwizz at this....... I don't blame this lot for getting away with what they can.... I blame us for continually letting them get away with it.... 
Link ..http://thehoopla.com...-profits-facts/
#180
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 07:28 PM
You are spectacularly missing the mark man haha.
Educate me.
#181
_Liam_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 07:44 PM
It is essentially damn near impossible for working class employees (such as ourselves) to be overly wealth greedy, yeah we can always put our hands up for overtime, do side jobs of the like but nothing to really classify yourself as greedy, now say you had absolutely no debt whatsoever are wanting foe any money due to circumstances of your good business sense, and you are doing fine, but you then cut costs relentlessly and increase rates of your product even though you definitely don't need the extra income but you are literally doing just to increase your holdings for no other reason except for you want more money for less, that is greed.
Are not wanting for money *
Are not wanting for money *
#182
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 07:46 PM
I fail to see how smashing down more wells and hiring more people is cost cutting.
I also fail to see the price increase.
#183
_Liam_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 07:47 PM
What are you on about? I'm talking hypothetical.
#184
_Liam_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 07:52 PM
On CSG mining. I have nothing against any of these mining companies taking our resources as long as we (as the nation) is compensated well for external companies rights to mine our natural resources for their gain.
#185
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 07:57 PM
Your talking hypothetical but taking it out of current context.
I didnt realize you intentionally took it out of the current context, in which case i agree with your assessment.
Cheers.
#186
_Liam_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:12 PM
No worries bud it's all good. You fix that whirly bird yet?
#187
Rockoz
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:15 PM
They actually do pay for it.
They pay for mineral rights.
The mining tax was an extra.
Now if you want to talk about businesses that are greedy I would be looking at banks a long time before I looked at CSG companies.
#188
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:19 PM
And companies like MacDonalds...
Na Liam havnt done the wirly bird yet 
Got side tracked....Try to do it this long weekend methinks.
Cheers.
#189
_Liam_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:21 PM
Oh Rob, without getting into a rhetoric ring around, you can't actually be insisting that the small price they paid for the mining rights as well as Royalties which were outdated and minor, is fair compensation for the 10's of billions they pull from our country yearly are you?
#190
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:35 PM
Liam
That isnt up to me to decide.
But given that a friend of mine who managed to keep mineral rights on some of his property. and when he was compensated, was made a rich man, along with his brother, its not peanuts that are being paid. And it wasnt a huge property either.
Whats the alternative?
Stop it all?
Now that would be so good for the country.
(sarcasm intended in case it didnt come through)
#191
_Liam_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:41 PM
I said fair compensation not even 6 posts up! Oh btw compensation for individuals on mining properties far exceeds compensation paid to Gov. Drastically.
#192
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:43 PM
I definitely agree the gov should screw for more money, but....
Sadly knowing our government (not just the current ones in power, them in an entirety) they would spend 3x any extra they got whilst negotiating the extra then working out where to put it.
Cheers.
#193
_Liam_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:46 PM
Yep I agree DJ, they are a bunch, as a whole, of detached unrelatable drones who have noones best interests but their own in place.
#194
_Bomber Watson_
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 08:57 PM
Could we agree there there due to greed?
#195
Rockoz
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 09:11 PM
They got 2 lots of payments.
The govt. took away their mineral rights and they were compensated less than the govt would receive in mineral rights.
That made them fairly wealthy. Wealthy enough that most normal people would be able to retire on very comfortably.
Then there was another payment after a class action where they got paid what the govt would have received in royalties.
That was the icing on the cake.
Like I said its not peanuts.
The mining company didnt care. Cost them the same either way.
As for screwing more money, there is a balance that needs to be kept.
There are other countries that have resources too.
The reason they get them here is because of being competitive.
Ups and downs in the dollar, and whether the contracts were signed in AUD or USD and the variations all play a part.
Supply and demand is only one part of it.
Make it too expensive and they get it from somewhere else.
So where is the balance point on the whole big picture?
There are social, economic and environmental issues that all need their own balance, and be in a balance with the others.
#196
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 09:46 PM
Top 10 Aus earners. If all these companies were paying there 30% company tax imagine the revenue.
http://www.businessr...-Companies-2014
BHP Billiton $72.1bn
Rio Tinto $59.8bn
Wesfarmers $58.4bn
Woolworths Limited $55.5bn
National Australia Bank $48.5bn
Commonwealth Bank of Australia $47.1bn
Westpac Bank of Australia $42.3bn
Australian and New Zealand Banking Group $40bn
Telstra $25.6bn
Xstrata Holdings $23.1bn
#197
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 09:54 PM
Couldnt find the reference.
Are those figures their value? Earnings? Profit?
Values in Australia/overseas/both?
And if you reduce their profits who do you hurt?
Lots of private investors/individuals who invest in these businesses.
Reduce their profits you reduce their dividends and in the case of members of my family, directly affect their retirement income.
#198
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Posted 31 March 2015 - 10:02 PM
it doesnt say. heres another one that has pretty much same figures and says its revenue.
http://www.news.com....c-1227274965176
#199
_ChaosWeaver_
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Posted 01 April 2015 - 07:29 AM
83 % of the Mining Industry is foreign owned ...........
We’ve had a week of bamboozling statistics as the Federal Government brought down the budget and the opposition presented its alternative.
Neither presented a particular pretty picture – at least not for average workers.
But as baby bonuses and some planned carbon tax compensation payments are done away with, it must be truly gratifying for the big miners to know that having largely escaped the burden of the mining tax, they can continue to pocket their profits and government subsidies – and shovel much of it overseas.
Some 83 per cent of the mining industry in Australia is foreign owned. And according to an Australia Institute report, 81 per cent of their profits went abroad. Take the three biggest miners in Australia:
- BHP, which we like to think is Australian, is in fact 76% foreign owned based on the domicile of its investors.
- Rio Tinto is 83% foreign owned
- X-Strata is 100% foreign owned.
- Fortescue, Twiggy Forrest’s company, is 40% foreign owned.
- Of the 100% Australian owned miners, foreign investment funds and companies have heavily invested in them.
#200
_ChaosWeaver_
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Posted 01 April 2015 - 07:33 AM
Opposition leader Tony Abbott plans on scrapping the tax. But despite the paltry earnings of the mining tax, will axing it be fair? The miner’s profits are lower – but far from low.
All of the companies doing the digging have historically paid royalties to the states. But these were woefully small which is why Kevin Rudd as prime minister decided to impose a 40 per cent super profits tax on all mining and petroleum companies on the realized value of the resource deposits they extracted.
As history shows, Julia Gillard renegotiated the tax with a handful of the big miners, after she ousted Mr. Rudd. The result is a 22.5% MRRT on a handful of iron ore and coal companies whose resource profits tip $50 million per annum.
The miners’ profits are enormous whether commodity prices are high or low. Even with profits on the decline because of lower commodity prices, the miners are expected to continue to strike bigger profit margins than the average Australian company for the next 25 years.
Until this financial year, BHP’s profit margins have been steadily increasing. In fact, since 2003, they’ve doubled. Lower commodity prices amongst other factors, have seen BHP’s revenues fall 14% which sounds like a lot until you look at the profits – $15.4 billion.
Rio also posted net losses but profits still exceeded expectations – $9 billion in 2012.
Gina Rinehart’s Hancock Prospecting posted a $3.27 billion headline profit in its 2012 financial report.
But the MMRT, designed as a tax on super profits rather than normal profits, hasn’t bitten into these figures because it allows the miners to offset the values of their mines against the tax. Some are actually receiving tax credits. BHP, Rio, Fortesque and Hancock booked tax credits worth $6.4 billion in 2012.
With tax credits that large, the chances of any of the big mining four paying any mining tax in the foreseeable future is slim.
Of course, like death, there’s no escaping tax. They all pay tax on their profits. Hancock Prospecting for example, paid $500 million for the year to June 30, 2012 out of its $3.27 billion profit. In Hancock’s case, the company’s profits make Gina Rinehart richer by the minute.
Though its hard to be exact because of fluctuating commodity prices and changing investment patterns, figures from a briefing paper for The Greens shows that “from 2011-12 to 2015-16 foreign owners will earn $265 billion from their investments in Australia’s mining resources, an average $53 billion per annum. Over half of the forecast profits relate to iron ore and a significant component is from coal.”
The paper emphasizes that a large percentage of profits will be reinvested in Australia.
But a lot still makes its way overseas. Of the $37 billion profit to foreign equity owners in the 12 months to 31 March 2011, $7 billion was paid overseas as dividends or income withdrawals. Seven billion!
Some think this is state-sponsored theft. Others understand that without heavy overseas investment, the mining industry with the employment it provides and the taxes it pays, would be under-resourced at best and non-existent at worst.
Perhaps Australia would find a more acceptable middle ground if some of the handouts to the miners were subjected to some soul searching.
Since 2009, the WA Government for example, has given miners $9.2 million under an “Exploration Incentive Scheme”. Gina Rinehart pocketed nearly $39,000. Andrew “Twiggy” Forrest took nearly $62,000.
Last year Ms. Rinehart grew nearly $19 billion richer. If would take her just over a minute to earn the $39,000 she took from the West Australian taxpayers.
If you don’t believe me, take a look at this: http://www.howrichareyou.com.au
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